Triangle road & traffic thread

[orulz]

Heading south, 55 is also four lanes at least as far as O'Kelly Chapel Road (sorta wish they had a stoplight there.) Not sure if it's finished clear into Apex. Doesn't look like they've got the final layer of pavement done on much of the highway yet though.

[ChiefJoJo]

N&O reported this morning that NC55 will be open--minnus the final pavement layer--today.

[orulz]

Was fully open north of Morrisville-Carpenter Rd at 9:00am today. Still had orange barrels blocking off a lane on at least one side of the highway south of there.

New NC55 feels like the autobahn right now, but give it 10 years and it will be just as choked as as it was before the widening.

[RaleighRob]

I like how WRAL comments blame the delays on "environmental whacos" (sic) and "safety concerns". I'm pretty sure neither of these were a factor in the I-40 widening in Durham or western 540 south of I-40.

That person obviously had some kinda rightwing agenda, I'm guessing.

Environmental issues, 99% of the time, are hashed out long before construction actually begins, including planning and permitting. The NCDOT actually now has a process in which both federal and state environmental agencies actually help plan large new highway projects early on. (As one can imagine, the benefits of this are substantial later on in the project, to avoiding environmental conflicts.) Then the DOT calculates an estimate of the finish date, including all environmental protection measures that need to be built along with the road itself.

The only times I know of a road project, once construction actually started, being delayed due to environmental issues, is when the contractor failed to follow the permit plans and something wrong happens. And that's certainly not the fault of "environmental wackos"....and usually not the direct fault of DOT either.

The biggest reasons, from what I've been told, that I-540 has been delayed is due to the drenching downpours we had in November. You can't pave in that kinda weather.

[ChiefJoJo]

I was just there yesterday at 15/501 & Europa and it looks like this project is under construction.

... from this:

to this:

[orulz]

I drive by this place several times a week, it's been under construction for the last few months.

Seems like this will help traffic flow, but it also seems like it will make the movement going straight across from Europa to Erwin (and vice versa) not just inconvenient - but damn near impossible.

There are, however, in my opinion, bigger problems that could have been solved without such extreme measures on the 15-501 corridor. From my observation, the stoplights at Eastowne and near the BCBS building (The first two lights south of I-40) are completely sensor-controlled, 24-hours a day. They both seem programmed to give traffic on 15/501 about a 30-second green cycle, and once it's gone beyond that, the instant a single car pulls up on Eastowne, the lights on the highway turn to yellow. Even at 5:15 in the afternoon.

I've always thought that NCDOT could get massive improvements on 15/501 by just tweaking the signal timing.

And while the light at Europa did have confusing geometry, some re-striping could have fixed it to allow simultaneous left turns from Europa and Erwin. The intersection just north of here (Sage / Scarlett / Old Durham.. plus frontage roads) is ten times worse. Why not spend the money they used for the Europa superstreet, to fix that one first?

[Spatula]

It looks like there's a way to get to all the same places, just more circuitously. I think the main idea is that the north and south directions on 501 have less resistance, so they'll go much faster, and there will be less cars on the road to get in the way of Europa/Erwin transits.

[orulz]

Looks like the Davis Drive widening has a green light. It's scheduled to start next month, and be done by November 2009. The project will also include widening NC54 between Davis and Miami.

NC55, Davis, and a number of other planned and in-progress improvements are designed to distribute the traffic that I-540 will bring. The roads will provide the framework to continue the monotonous, clearcut, heavily graded sprawl that has already begun to replace the wooded landscapes and rolling hills that dominate western Wake.

Sounds like it's certain that 540 (from 55 in RTP to 55 in Apex) and the Triangle Parkway will only proceed forwards as toll roads. Sounds fine to me. I wonder what things would be like if all of 540, from the very first segment in 1997, had been built as a toll road. Raleigh probably wouldn't look much different than it does today.

[dmccall]

I-540 in the NW corner opens today. Cost: $114million for the 9-mile stretch. That's $12.7 million per mile.

[DanRNC]

The head of the DOT said that all future 540 construction will have to be paid with by tolls and also alluded that this may be the case all over the state for new highway construction. Whats interesting is that tax payers get a double hit on this deal especially in larger metros. We pay to fund road construction in rural parts of the state but then have to pay again to use our roads. Why does this make any sense?

[orulz]

The head of the DOT said that all future 540 construction will have to be paid with by tolls and also alluded that this may be the case all over the state for new highway construction.*

* except rural areas, particularly those east of I-95.

The change is, the money that should be going toward transit & urban infrastructure to support high-quality infill and smart growth is being redirected to rural areas, rather than being redirected to loop highways in urban areas.

[DanRNC]

First day of 540 opened with congestion. I think this is hilarious and sad at the same time.

Story

[dombalis]

http://www.newsobserver.com/102/story/533535.html

Triangle leaders have complained that the region is shortchanged by a legislative formula that guides much of DOT's spending for road construction and other projects. The "equity formula" divides some of the money according to local census counts, but critics say it ignores urban traffic congestion. The local backlog grew recently when DOT said it would postpone some big projects in its 2007-2013 spending plan.

What big projects are they talking about here?

[sax184]

First day of 540 opened with congestion. I think this is hilarious and sad at the same time.

Story

THen we better widen I-540, quick!

The sadder thing is that some people will take this to mean that we need a third beltway around Raleigh.

[DanRNC]

Honestly, the transit folks (collaboratively) in the Triangle need to address the failings of 540 in a open letter to all the media outlets immediately and point out that the "rubber to the road" anti-transit zealots have had their shot and failed miserably and that new/radical solutions must be used to adress our failing transportation infrastructure.

[ncwebguy]

While some drivers will eventually figure out the "shortcut" of exiting at Lumley or Airport Blvd, it is still faster to sit in the 540 to 40 west back up.

It will only get worse when 540 is extended to NC 55 this summer. With Apex, Holly Springs, F-V, and other residents on "inner" 540 approacing 40 from the south and getting on 40 west, it will be even more difficult for the "outer" 540 traffic. Merging into the full right lane created by commuters from points south and trying to get over before the Page Road exit will be a nightmare.

The 540/NC 54 interchange will handle some RTP traffic, but I doubt it will be enough to fix the problem. There have already been suggestions of taking a lane from I 40 west before the 540 interchange. DOT will probably go for that, since keeping I-40 at two lanes from Wade Ave. to US 1 is not due to receive any funding through 2012.

[orulz]

The problem at the I-540 / I-40 merge is the proximity of the Page Rd exit. That causes the I-540 offramp to act as a de-facto weave lane.

The way that NCDOT cheaped out on the 40/540 interchange is going to come back and bite them in the ass. I predict that we'll see a TIP project for some additional flyover ramps at this interchange within 5 years. And the pattern of suburban loop roads solving nothing and only begetting more congestion and more expensive construction projects continues.

[RaleighRob]

http://www.newsobserver.com/102/story/533535.html

What big projects are they talking about here?

Well, I-40 widening between Wade Ave and US 1/64 is sorely in need and won't be done anytime soon.

Also, I-440 between Wade and I-40 is also in dire need of widening.

I imagine the fact the Western arch of I-540 being handed off to the Turnpike Authority is also one aspect they're not crazy about.

Plus the widening of Tryon Road being financed by the cities of Raleigh and Cary, even though it's a state-owned road.

Just a few I can think of.

(Not to mention that we've got a ton of bridges that are in bad condition and need replacing.)

[Transplant]

While some drivers will eventually figure out the "shortcut" of exiting at Lumley or Airport Blvd, it is still faster to sit in the 540 to 40 west back up.

It will only get worse when 540 is extended to NC 55 this summer. With Apex, Holly Springs, F-V, and other residents on "inner" 540 approacing 40 from the south and getting on 40 west, it will be even more difficult for the "outer" 540 traffic. Merging into the full right lane created by commuters from points south and trying to get over before the Page Road exit will be a nightmare.

The 540/NC 54 interchange will handle some RTP traffic, but I doubt it will be enough to fix the problem. There have already been suggestions of taking a lane from I 40 west before the 540 interchange. DOT will probably go for that, since keeping I-40 at two lanes from Wade Ave. to US 1 is not due to receive any funding through 2012.

This is accurate. Page Rd Exit should be closed. People will figure new driving patterns out.

[blburton]

For the RTP/Airport area of the Triangle/I-40, it would have made much more sense if collector lanes were constructed for all interchanges between Airport Pkwy and Hwy 55. There are several vital interchanges linking the RTP to I-40 within one or two miles. Essentially, you'd have an additional 2 lanes in both directions carrying entering and exiting traffic while all other traffic heading to points west flow unimpeded. I've also seen discussion about the addition of HOV lanes from Johnston County to the Orange/Durham County line. COMPLETELY UNNECESSARY!!!!

The problem is two-fold. Uncontrolled, rapid suburban sprawl secondary to poor town and city planning - roads and interchanges that once handled formerly rural traffic are obsolete and have been for years. NCDOT - it's a no brainer (and has been for decades) that the Triangle's population would boom because of the RTP, but the original construction of I-40 through the Triangle resembled an interstate you'd find on I-85 north of Durham where the land for the most part is sparsely populated.

While some drivers will eventually figure out the "shortcut" of exiting at Lumley or Airport Blvd, it is still faster to sit in the 540 to 40 west back up.

It will only get worse when 540 is extended to NC 55 this summer. With Apex, Holly Springs, F-V, and other residents on "inner" 540 approacing 40 from the south and getting on 40 west, it will be even more difficult for the "outer" 540 traffic. Merging into the full right lane created by commuters from points south and trying to get over before the Page Road exit will be a nightmare.

The 540/NC 54 interchange will handle some RTP traffic, but I doubt it will be enough to fix the problem. There have already been suggestions of taking a lane from I 40 west before the 540 interchange. DOT will probably go for that, since keeping I-40 at two lanes from Wade Ave. to US 1 is not due to receive any funding through 2012.

[ChiefJoJo]

The I-540 debacle is not unique, although NC does seem to have the habit of underbuilding new corridors. It only gets worse when all of the interchanges get filled with commercial projects, in much the same way that Dunwoody became a major speed bump on Atlanta's Perimeter. In order to recover the land costs, the projects have to go big around the interchanges, so the nodal slowdowns will eventually fill the entire length of the freeway, and everybody knows that.

The sad thing is that I-540 was billed as a panacea for the east Wake and Down East folks (to the airport, RTP, Durham, etc.) Point in fact, once Leesville, Six Forks, and Falls of the Neuse get filled in, and Capital starts backfilling regularly out the interchange (which may in fact be happening already) it may actually come to pass that people will start using New Bern to downtown, and Wade Ave. out again in order to save time. A regional transit system (TTA + Eastrans) might help reduce some of these trips, but it's proven thing that freeways create their own traffic, and then some.

Tolls aren't the answer either. We have a our own white elephants here in Denver (actually a trio of them), the E-470 and Northwest Tollways, plus another under construction, all of which constitute about two-thirds of Denver's "beltway" system. The former two both opened with tolls so high that they are substantially underused (E-470 costs around $12 per car (much more for trucks) just to circumnavigate Denver -- about a 25-mile trip). Northwest Tollway just opened in the last two years, and is already teetering on insolvency. E-470 has been open for the better part of a decade, and the bonds are junk. Developments are being placed around both routes, but in the case of E-470, the parallel Gun Club Road (which is free) handles almost the same amount of traffic as the highway itself. But for the most part, the adjacent land is still dominated by tumbleweeds.

Freeways (beltways in particular) hyperinflate the demand for housing on the periphery, and create a land-cost structure that almost guarantees that traffic demand will surely exceed supply. I agree with Mayor Meeker in that in lieu of expanding I-540 all the way around the south end beyond Holly Springs, it might be a better bang for the buck deal to improve Ten-Ten and whole gaggle of surface streets to handle the traffic without putting development on a speed binge.

[ncwebguy]

After reading the posts on here, it begs the question of why *wasn't* the I-40/540 interchange near RDU built with collector lanes to begin with?

Outer 540 at 40 has a collector lane, and all 40 traffic going to inner 540 will merge before the 540 merge. But if the inner 540-Aviation Parkway interchange deserved a collector lane, I-40 east and west should have as well. I know there is the pond north of 40, but there is enough land south of the interchange to create a slight bend to the south. The I-540 approach to 40 on both sides does not leave the option to add collector lanes without serious work. They widened 40 from three to four lanes *after* the 540 interchange construction, leaving no easy space for future expansion. The dirt in place will be difficult to remove to widen 40. 540 chould have bridged over 40 at least a lane, if not two, more in each direction than it does now.

If the 40/440/US 1 intersection near South Hills/Crossroads deserved the collector lane treatment in three of four directions (east and westbound 40, southbound 440/US 1) why not 40/540, especially with two exits less than a mile away -- the Page Road exit to the west and Airport Blvd to the east?

[DPK]

Don't know if this has already been posted in here as I'm new to this forum. I found this place while doing research on abandoned property in Detroit, but I live here in Raleigh so...

Western Wake Parkway

http://www.ncturnpike.org/projects/Western_Wake/

Here is a map detailing the connection to the "end" of what will be the extension on 540 by RDU Airport to NC-55 south of Apex:

http://www.ncturnpike.org/pdf/WesternWake_Map.pdf

Apparently there will be a meeting on Feb. 8th to talk about it all at Apex High School. If this is old news, my bad. I see people are talking about the Turnpike Authority so if anything I'm posting this just for reference. My parents live in southern Cary with their backyard literally switching over into Apex so this would make it alot quicker for me to get to them.

[ChiefJoJo]

All you Durhamites... here's some more information on the Durham East End Connector project:

--> a flash media (ppt) presentation on the project

--> a Jan 07 project newsletter, which includes alternative alignments for the project

There is an informational meeting on the project next week, Jan 30th from 4-7pm at

Living Waters Christian Community Church

1104 Lynn Rd

Durham, NC 27703

I had never heard this until recently, but the spread in the median on NC 147 south of Alston Ave is the place where the East End Connector was planned all those years--probably 40--ago. Pretty amazing it's taken all this time to get it going...

If you look at the newsletter, Alt #2 is a straight-shot (and I'd wager where it was orginally planned to go all those years ago), but also very complex and expensive ($200M) and has plenty of impacts (=not good)... using my engineering judgement, I'd bet they end up picking Alt #3... it's cheapest ($135M), has the lowest relocations (53 total), provides good access, and is minimally complex compared to the others.

[orulz]

I'm pretty sure alternative 3 was where this was planned to go all along. It most closely resembles the alignment maps that I've seen so far.

Tell me if this "proposal" makes sense or not:

• Re-label the road west from the EEC (presently NC147 / Durham Freeway) as US-70.
  
• Keep the US-70 designation for the road east from the EEC
  
• Re-label the road north from the EEC (presently US-70 Bypass) as NC147
  
• Keep the NC147 designation for the road south from the EEC
  

Basically this would turn US-70 into an east-west route, and NC147 into a north-south route, and they would intersect at the EEC.

NC147 could be re-labeled as I-585 (for example) once the current US-70 bypass is brought up to interstate standards.

This does a couple things:

1. Eliminates all but a couple miles of the I-85/US70 multiplex

2. Provides clear, consistently signed east-west and north-south routes through the triangle.

This would have been a good alternative to the I-85 mega-widening. We probably could have gotten by with a 6-ish lane I-85, if we'd built the EEC and strategically re-labeled some roads. Maybe there's not much point to it now that I-85 has been widened to a bajillion lanes, but the idea of a clear I-40 alternate is still attractive.