500 West Trade (14 story apartments on site of former Polk Building)

[monsoon]

Looks as if J&W is not going to get this building. Easley has ended the deal and instead the State is going to vacate the building and sell it to a real estate developer for $5M-$6M. What will go there and if the building will be leveled is anyone's guess at this point.

[atlrvr]

Wait....is this an update from today? Because congress still has the power to overturn Easley on this unless they relented.

If someone does buy it for $5.5 million, then they would have something pretty major planned for the site.....about 250k-300k sq. ft. would be required.

[monsoon]

Yes. Apparently they relented.

More info here.

[Norm2]

What do you all think Johnson and Whales will do now since their promised land is gone?

[eastsider]

I don't think the land was promised, $10 million dollars was promised. J&W just agreed to take it as part of that payment.

[dubone]

No one disputes that the state owes j&w ~$8m.

I guess black's stand, is that the state saves money by giving them land woth $5.3m to the market, but that j&w would accept as payment in full. The state is also in that land for little money, and gets out of an obligation without needing to spend cash.

Easley's stand is that the state needs the cash now from the sale, and that when ever in some distant future we give J&W their money, it needs to have all the proper red strings attached.

Interesting little battle.

In many ways, i think it will be better for charlotte if they sell the land (which looks like is the final answer on what they're doing). That would mean that some one is putting cash in to the trade street land, and will likely build some project with a little height in order to make back their money.

J&W will inevitable expand, and can now look to do so in other parts of third or 4th ward. Potentially, they could go on some of the land between the park and the tracks in third ward.

now, of course, it is also possible that J&w will simply buy this land, from the investors anyway.

[atlrvr]

Well....the articile in today's observer says it was sold to Trinity Capital Adivsors. They have claimed their plans are to renovate the building, which is very surprising, and a bit disappointing Perhaps they will add a second parking deck and new building at 5th and Graham on the site.

[dubone]

I guess it is a 1920s building, so if they renovate it, it might not be so bad. Do you think they will/can put another building on the land?

[atlrvr]

I'm under the impression that they own the entire block....they can certainly add another building by 5th if they do. Decked parking to serve both buildings would allow this, but who knows.....stupid Easley, especially since a NY developer would have paid $7M......

Of course Trinity could always elect to raze the buidling anyways, and build more student apartments.

[eastsider]

From what I got out of today's aricle, it sounds like Easley never agreed to the incentive package, it was just the local rep's. This whole thing has more twists and turns than I can keep up with.

[dubone]

yeah, i can't keep up, either. maybe black can reach into his slush fund and get it over with.

[monsoon]

Yes, the point of this is there was never a commitment from the State of NC to give the School the money. J&W isn't going anywhere and they are not going to make a big stink out it.

Personally I am against this kind of give away anyway, so I think Easley did his job by protecting the taxpayers of NC, including those in Charlotte.

[bork]

I walked by this building yesterday - besides the cameraman focusing on it - there was a "For Sale by State of North Carolina" sign up. Perhaps they just haven't taken it down?

[tuthdoc]

Not living there yet, I have been trying to keep up with this story for a while but it is certainly difficult. I have to say that IMO this deal smells. The following is just my opinion, mind you, but anyone can look at the public records to see the facts.

Easley had the opportunity to write off $8m of debt for $5.5 in a land swap deal with J & W. Would any of you pass on the chance to save $2.5m for your kids??? OK - even if for some reason the cash was needed right now, the last minute way in which things were done knocked other developers out of the loop that were ready to buy for $7m or more. Essentially, the change in deadline to the 21st from the 31st killed open bidding on the project because other developers could not get their cash for the downpayment that fast. So, at that, the Gov cost the taxpayers $1.5m. That's a lot of money to give away just to beat a deadline on a deal that had so many contingencies it could have been postponed anyway. There's probably more to the story that we'll never know and details that maymake this deal make perfect sense.

As an aside, do you know that Mr. Allen aka Trinity donated $8000 to the Gov's campaign in 2004? Do you know that that amount is as much as Bank Of America PAC donated? That's quite a bit of funding...

How convenient is it that a major campaign contributor was able to get contested property at an extreme dioscount in a last minute gov't maneuver. His downpayment was in place (the only one bidding to my knowledge) and, best of all, the final use of the property will be "renovated office space". How unique, creative and beneficial for the city...

Sorry to be a downer but it was very disappointing to see this happen.

[eastsider]

I think the question is why Jim Black would promise a $10 million incentive package without state appoval?

[atlrvr]

Because Jim Black had congressional approval......

tuthdoc......I wonder if the state will lease back the space once it is all nice and shiny.....also, I wonder if the state will give money to Trinity since they had approved funds for an exterior renovation......the whole deal is beyond fishy. Any way you look at it, the governor is costing the state more money in the long run.

[tuthdoc]

I think the question is why Jim Black would promise a $10 million incentive package without state appoval?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

On that point, I would agree. However, the school is there - they came to Charlotte on a promise and, by all intentions, they are a "good neighbor". I can't think of a situation where investing in a school campus has been detrimental, economically or otherwise, to a community.

The Carolina Journal describes the sale as "outmaneuvering" the legistative process. The land sale was turned into one big peeing contest with intent to show Black that he can't just throw money around. OK. Now, the land has been sold under market value, J&W would still like to expand but now will likely not have any foreseeable options and, unless J&W receives some sort of restitution down the line, I think a fine institution is being undermined. Who exactly won here?

[monsoon]

I don't think that anyone would argue that investing in a downtown schools is bad business.

However I think it is Black, not Easley, who is at fault here. He promised the money without having the necessary legislative support to backup that promise now he's got egg all over his face. The local media, of course has blamed the wrong person.

The unfortunate fact that NC politics is very unpredictable and promises are really just that. Don't count on anything happening unless there is a bill signed into law. Concerning these rumors that someone wanted to pay more for the building but couldn't because Easley was giving out political favors, I am not so sure about. I would want to know exactly who offered this and what they have to say about it now that they have lost out.

[tuthdoc]

I don't think that anyone would argue that investing in a downtown schools is bad business. 

However I think it is Black, not Easley, who is at fault here.  He promised the money without having the necessary legislative support to backup that promise now he's got egg all over his face.  The local media, of course has blamed the wrong person.

The unfortunate fact that NC politics is very unpredictable and promises are really just that.  Don't count on anything happening unless there is a bill signed into law.  Concerning these rumors that someone wanted to pay more for the building but couldn't because Easley was giving out political favors, I am not so sure about.  I would want to know exactly who offered this and what they have to say about it now that they have lost out.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't think any of us will ever really know - that's what makes politics what it is today. It's unpredictable everywhere and not always in the constituents' best interest. As far as the media goes, I don't think their political coverage ever goes particularly deep enough. Don't get me wrong, I'm not some kind of conspiracy theorist. It just seems that the media doesn't probe too deeply when it doesn't suit their angle or there's no blood involved. Most Americans would probably change the channel anyway.

As far as Black goes, I don't really know the guy so it's all conjecture. It seems to me like he was cut loose when the "slush fund" controversy came up and now this was just a good excuse to "take a stand" against the issue. Honestly, they are all at fault. I just think it could have been resolved much more efficiently. It was a great opportunity for compromise. Instead, it's an office park. Hopefully Trinity will stick to its word and do what it can to help the school grow.

On the other hand...

It's great to have found a forum where all of this can be shared, isn't it?!!

[eastsider]

An article from today's Raleigh News & Observer:

Easley sautes land deals

[monsoon]

...

It's great to have found a forum where all of this can be shared, isn't it?!!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Indeed. Thanks for joining us.

[tuthdoc]

OK - like I said, most of us have no idea what's really going on. Here is an article on $13m which is now being given to J&W as NC education subsidies. To make a long story short, the law was changed to allow this gift even though J&W is not headquartered in NC. Again, always a great idea to support schools and giving students the subsidies directly is even better. However, now it is easy to understand why Easley blocked an additional $5-6m with this in the works. At this point, I would say that NC has fulfilled it's obligation, however, Black still wants to appropriate the additional money to fulfill his promise. Maybe time for J&W to thank the taxpayers for their support and accept the $13m as payment in full??? Jeeeez...

Here's the article

http://www.charlotte.com/mld/charlotte/new...cs/11304939.htm

[A2]

Thought I would post this since I do not think it has been mentioned.

They are now taking soil samples around the Polk Building site. I do not know what is going to go "UP" there, but if I had my guess more residential. Boy a nice apartment tower would sure be nice since vacanies are near record lows because of all of the condos in Center city. One can only hope. I know the market is tough to justify a developer going rental, but just maybe there is a smart developer out there that knows to building one would mean staying ahead of the curve on rental units. With rates rising and condos in full swing, NOW is the opportunity (from a business standpoint) to start building rentals again. JMHO. The condo craze will continue, but at some point this building boom will have to resort to rentals as the buying power peters out in the next 3-5 years for owning condos.

A2

Edited October 26, 2005 by A219724

[atlrvr]

From what I've heard, the building is a gonner, and judging from what they paid for the land, it will definetly need to be a high-rise.

I think it is a great spot for apartments (near a transit station and JWU), plus like you said A2, there is considerable demand. However, if apartments do get built there, they will probably be the most expensive ones in Uptown (based on land cost, and the huge rise in building costs).....I'm guessing in the $1.70 per square foot per month range.

[dubone]

ouch on the price. and ouch on tearing down an 80 year old building.

but a highrise will be good. our skyline will really be growing up in the next few years, especially west.