The Vue

[stateman99]

I have been browsing through this thread and haven't read everything so excuse me if this has been said, but the reason the Vue does not fully release there pre-sale numbers is that they don't want to scare potential buyers away. The feel that if a potential buyer sees the numbers they will feel that too many places have been sold and that there will be no good units left. Just my 2 Cents.

[sleightofhand]

^I was told they had a problem in Orlando when they released their sales figures.

Apparently once they got around 50% sold people thought they had missed all the good deals. On the flip side once they got to 80% sold then they had a problem with people speculating something was wrong because they weren't completely sold out.

Thus, they've decided not to release sales figures for the Charlotte site. I gather the people who have purchased in the Vue are a little more privy to that type of info.

[Richhamleigh, DC]

It makes you wonder, would the developer be willing to front some cash to get earthmoving equipment on the site and digging as a sign of commitment.

Obviously, the Vue has announced enough pre-sells that they don't need to do this, but it could be a way to accelerate sells.

On the flip side, many developers prefer to not have as many pre-sells, because they can typically raise the price of units once it is under construction.....the risk is gone for the buyer, so they pay more.

Seems as though they could get the thing going and plan to reserve x through z floors for rental - especially since the rental market seems to be heating up. Which raises an interesting question...will we see high-rise apartment buildings appear downtown?

Edited June 14, 2006 by Phillydog

[Charlotte_native]

Apparently once they got around 50% sold people thought they had missed all the good deals. On the flip side once they got to 80% sold then they had a problem with people speculating something was wrong because they weren't completely sold out.

Thus, they've decided not to release sales figures for the Charlotte site. I gather the people who have purchased in the Vue are a little more privy to that type of info.

I don't understand how releasing all the sales info scares off buyers. That isn't the case with every other project in town that does release all the info from the beginning. Everyone else posts units, prices, etc, from the first marketing stage -- in print, if you call, at the sales center. The "scare the buyer looking for a good deal" logic might be the case somewhere else, but I think it is backwards for Charlotte. No other similar property I can think of does this, and they all sell out unless there are other problems (i.e. The Park).

Does anyone have proof that this scenario happens? That buyers think after the first round of sales all the "deals" are gone so they won't buy? I've never seen that happen at all -- if anything buyers move faster on Charlotte projects when they see few units available because they don't want to be left out.

The people who are buying are not told either. I have two friends with units under contract and they have been demanding the developer tell them how many are sold so they can get a guesstimate on when things will start...no one will tell them.

I think keeping your info so secret hurts and scares off buyers far more than letting them know. You have no idea if they are telling the truth when they say sales are great, you have no idea when they will break ground, and you have no idea how long they are going to hold your earnest money.

[stateman99]

Does anyone have proof that this scenario happens? That buyers think after the first round of sales all the "deals" are gone so they won't buy? I've never seen that happen at all -- if anything buyers move faster on Charlotte projects when they see few units available because they don't want to be left out.

I don't have proof other than a realitor that is selling units at the Vue said this. I thought it odd too, but I guess there is no reason why they can't be different from the others.

[Charlotte_native]

I don't have proof other than a realitor that is selling units at the Vue said this. I thought it odd too, but I guess there is no reason why they can't be different from the others.

They can be different, but most people think it is hurting their sales and from what we all see from the outside, that appears to be true. I've never heard the "scare the buyer" theory from anyone other than folks associated with The Vue.

[ElricSeven]

I don't understand how releasing all the sales info scares off buyers. That isn't the case with every other project in town that does release all the info from the beginning. Everyone else posts units, prices, etc, from the first marketing stage -- in print, if you call, at the sales center. The "scare the buyer looking for a good deal" logic might be the case somewhere else, but I think it is backwards for Charlotte. No other similar property I can think of does this, and they all sell out unless there are other problems (i.e. The Park).

Does anyone have proof that this scenario happens? That buyers think after the first round of sales all the "deals" are gone so they won't buy? I've never seen that happen at all -- if anything buyers move faster on Charlotte projects when they see few units available because they don't want to be left out.

The people who are buying are not told either. I have two friends with units under contract and they have been demanding the developer tell them how many are sold so they can get a guesstimate on when things will start...no one will tell them.

I think keeping your info so secret hurts and scares off buyers far more than letting them know. You have no idea if they are telling the truth when they say sales are great, you have no idea when they will break ground, and you have no idea how long they are going to hold your earnest money.

The scare the buyer theory is total baloney. Popularity and success begets only more interest and a sense of urgency. In my opinion, they're covering up slow sales.

Edited June 15, 2006 by ElricSeven

[monsoon]

The scare the buyer theory is total baloney. Popularity and success begets only more interest and a sense of urgency. In my opinion, they're covering up slow sales.

Indeed. They would love to be hanging out a "Almost Sold Out" sign or holding a lottery with people standing in line for it. It's frenzies like this that are developer's dream.

[Charlotte_native]

Indeed. They would love to be hanging out a "Almost Sold Out" sign or holding a lottery with people standing in line for it. It's frenzies like this that are developer's dream.

True -- note how happily most subdivisions and condo buildings put those slashes, numbers and language everywhere proudly proclaiming how few are left..."only 12 remaining.."!!

[stateman99]

True -- note how happily most subdivisions and condo buildings put those slashes, numbers and language everywhere proudly proclaiming how few are left..."only 12 remaining.."!!

i'm not saying i believe totally what i was told but it does make sense. I mean if i were looking for a place at the Vue and had the money for it, I would want a place on a higher floor with a better view. If i knew the place was almost sold out, I would pretty much assume that there were no good places there. That is different IMO from a standard 2 story condo or subdivision.

[ElricSeven]

i'm not saying i believe totally what i was told but it does make sense. I mean if i were looking for a place at the Vue and had the money for it, I would want a place on a higher floor with a better view. If i knew the place was almost sold out, I would pretty much assume that there were no good places there. That is different IMO from a standard 2 story condo or subdivision.

Yeah, but under this theory NO building would ever sell out because no building would attract any buyers past perhaps being 80% sold. Every building would stop dead at 80% and receive no further inquires, and no further sales, because all the good units are already sold. The idea that the place is really popular - and hence a good investment - is the number one tactic for driving the remaining sales. This may be even more important at the Vue where trendiness is half the sale. It certainly isn't driven by low price.

Conversely, if the Vue's theory holds true, what is the Vue going to do with the people who come in not knowing all the "good units" are sold? Somehow convince them to buy something else? Well, even if they buyer is willing to make a compromise then, they would be much more likely to do so knowing it is an incredibly in-demand building. I bought at Courtside without even seeing a floorplan first because I knew that if I walked away and gave myself time to think, there'd be nothing left when I got back. I really would have bought anything at the time guessing that it would be a great investment.

The sense of urgency that comes from missing an opportunity is a far, far stronger motivator that overrides any concern about a lack of selection. Try seeing what happens at Christmas when a certain popular toy is known to be selling out. It starts riots. Over a toy. Scarcity makes people crazy to get on board.

So, the Vue sales staff are either really stupid for not advertising how popular their building is, or they're clever like a fox. Spinning their lack of disclosure as being something special because their building and clientele is so special. "Oh (she bats her eyelashes), we don't tell how much have been sold because that would scare everyone away. Our clients are so rich they won't settle for anything but the best!" BS! Might as well have a building on stilts then with only penthouse units because such discerning clientele won't buy anything less than the top level.

[Charlotte_native]

i'm not saying i believe totally what i was told but it does make sense. I mean if i were looking for a place at the Vue and had the money for it, I would want a place on a higher floor with a better view. If i knew the place was almost sold out, I would pretty much assume that there were no good places there. That is different IMO from a standard 2 story condo or subdivision.

The question for me is, why should you have to make any assumptions? Why not just tell you if any higher floor units are available and which ones. As it is you can't just call or look on the website to find that out and if you go through the sales center you still won't look at a list. The primary question remains: WHY? With your scenario you as a truly interested buyer are still in the dark. ?

[monsoon]

That could be nothing more than the old real estate trick of not giving you the information you need to know about a property to force you to contact them directly about the place. That way the can put the sales pressure on you to buy something.

[Charlotte_native]

That could be nothing more than the old real estate trick of not giving you the information you need to know about a property to force you to contact them directly about the place. That way the can put the sales pressure on you to buy something.

At what point do you drop the trick when it isn't working? I don't know anyone that is fooled by this marketing and I've talked to folks at the city, buyers at The Vue, and real estate agents -- everyone with no exception thinks their sales are far below what they are trying to imply. If they were up where they needed to be, why not time-frame for breaking ground. At what point, when you only supposedly have a few left, do you just go out and let people know what they are and sell them.

Oh, thats right, no one would want the leftovers....I guess that is why Courtside and others always have units that never sell and sit vacant forever because the "good ones" are gone.

[MZT]

Aren't there posts in the Orlando thread about the Vue selling slower than expected? I smell marketing "spin".

Edited June 16, 2006 by MZT

[alpha.type.alpha]

hey guys, I haven't been on in a while.

There is one thing that I can try to instill in you guys and thats confidence.

Confidence in this project. This project is going to happen, and I am very confident in that fact and so are other prospective buyers at the vue like myself, I have gotten nothing but reassurance by the staff at Vue Charlotte.

[monsoon]

......I have gotten nothing but reassurance by the staff at Vue Charlotte.

Gee. Do you think the Vue sales staff would actually tell a prospective buyer....

"We don'tknow if there will be enough sales for this thing to be built but give us your money anyway, we will get back to you in 6-12 months, have a wonderful day".

[stateman99]

Man u guys are harsh. I was mearly saying that people at the Vue don't want others to think there top of the line units (so to speak) are gone. I beleive that they believe that all there units are good and that they could sell them to people who come in. One of those deals where they beleive they could sell there worse units to the potential buyer, if only they can get the buyer to the sales center.

[Charlotte_native]

Man u guys are harsh. I was mearly saying that people at the Vue don't want others to think there top of the line units (so to speak) are gone. I beleive that they believe that all there units are good and that they could sell them to people who come in. One of those deals where they beleive they could sell there worse units to the potential buyer, if only they can get the buyer to the sales center.

I'm very sorry, but that just doesn't make sense. Let people know what you have so they can choose. Simple and it works for every other project. That logic only justifies holding back information and the reasoning for it mystifies those in the business and in the field and it isn't working. Read the thread for 210 Trade, they practically had to close down the sales office yesterday for folks rushing in to reserve. Urgency and scarcity drive sales, not secrecy. I'm heading to the open house today, and I'll be my post after going will be that sales are soaring and no one is "scared" that they didn't get a good unit.

Those that want cheaper units will choose those, other that want penthouses will choose those, not letting them know what you have doesn't influence that process, it takes care of itself. A lessor unit to one person might be the perfect unit for another (like the one you can afford or the one that is cheaper OR the one with the best view, etc).

Most people I've talked to think they hold the lists and info so secret in order to get people into the sales office to heavy "pitch" them BEFORE they find out the prices are far in excess of everything else in center city. And they are likely right. If you knew before going that you could buy a similar unit with similar square footage and similar location / floor in the building for $150,000 - $200,000 less at The Avenue, then a lot of folks might not ever take a look at The Vue. The problem with the assumptions of that is once you are in the sales office and find out the prices you won't mind because the finishes are SO much better and the lobby is more fancy. I don't think that happens, sticker shock is sticker shock no matter at what point it occurs. People WANT to price shop, for cars, furniture, property, everything to make sure they are getting a good bang for their buck, this sales tactic seems to be created to prevent buyers from doing just that.

Competition is too heavy right now in center city for overpriced or strangely marketed properties. People are moving on to the competition that reveals their sales, has open sales with lists available, and properties that are actually started or have posted start dates.

[kelerbela]

Wow. Just had lunch with someone that recently looked at The Vue -- I didn't realize they actually want a whopping 20% down.

Only the penthouse buyers pay 20% (10% first deposit, 10% second deposit). It's a total of 10 or 15% for all other units.

[monsoon]

The Vue is running another full page advert in today's Observer. This isn't exactly a sign that people are salivating like Pavlov's dogs to line up to buy a place.

The advert says about the place.

Modern Classic. Urban Community

That would seem like a contradiction in terms, but I guess it is marketing. It also says you will see the world in a whole new way when you look through the floor to ceiling glass. Who writes this stuff?

If I were a potential buyer I note however there is nothing in the advert on pricing, availability, terms, amenities, etc. Apparently you have to call them or go in for that. Most of the page is whitespace.

[SmellyCat]

The Vue has been running full back page ads in the CBJ every week for the past year or so, it seems.

[Charlotteman]

We all seem to be holding our breath on this one........

The developers of the Vue have apparently spent LOTS of $$$ on advertising, going through permit processes, oodles and oodles of attorneys fees, etc. Would it be safe to say perhaps $2-3 million has been spent so far?

Of course any project can fall by the wayside--I wonder what the precident is for a developer to cancel a project after spending that kind of capital. Seems like it would be a devastating loss for a company to sustain.

[almondjoy]

We all seem to be holding our breath on this one........

The developers of the Vue have apparently spent LOTS of $$$ on advertising, going through permit processes, oodles and oodles of attorneys fees, etc. Would it be safe to say perhaps $2-3 million has been spent so far?

Of course any project can fall by the wayside--I wonder what the precident is for a developer to cancel a project after spending that kind of capital. Seems like it would be a devastating loss for a company to sustain.

Aside from their incessant advertising, they're doing a horrendous job of managing the press and public opinion. Save for that blurb about meeting presale requirements, they've been nonexistant in the news. They really should have planned some sort of PR blitz in the midst of all this 210 trade activity.

[Dale]

VUE Orlando is now at the 20th floor, is 87% sold, and is running its most spectacular ads to date.

Signed,

A Voice Crying In The Wilderness