NASCAR Hall of Fame

[dubone]

i think it is funny that all the local news stations are reporting this as a "why it won't affect your tax dollars" because it uses the tourist-based taxes. That argument didn't fly for basketball!

honestly, i think for many people, though, the fact that they have to ask for more hotel/motel tax just highlights that they spent the whole think on the arena.

the interviews with the council members, though, seem to indicate that they will be strict that the extra tax only go to HOF. i'm sure those statements are to reassure people, but i'm rather disappointed. i had hoped they could make it broader so that it could eventually fund other museums or similar projects. who knows, though, maybe that won't really be the case.

Again, i'm not a nascar fan at all, but i really hope charlotte's proposal wins!

[eastsider]

I would also like to find a way to get some funding to other projects. But, since it takes the state legislature to approve the addition hotel tax they likely wouldn't have for the other projects alone (they have expressed support for the hof). Maybe they could work out a system where 100% of the new tax goes to the nhof for a period of time (10 years ?) Then scale it back in incraments over time to include other projects.

[dubone]

i agree. mostly likely the point at which it would expire, the local groups would figure out how to use it in such a way to prevent it from being expired.

honestly, i hope the arena and nhof both end up actually increasing tourism, which spreads the wealth all around. who knows, it might even help to increase proceeds on the existing taxes, which would pay for other worthy projects, like arts/baseball/ or the McColl-Crutchfield Museum and Banking Hall of Fame..

[BryanH]

Finally some numbers. I feel that with Charlotte having chosen a site, picked a very well-respected and elite architect, and constructed a financial package, that Charlotte deserves this. Being down here in Atlanta for school, I have not heard that much so far on Atlanta's proposal. Charlotte is leaving everyone else in the dust.

[Raintree21]

- $37.5m will come from convention center fund to pay for parking for the NHOF.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Just to clarify, that money would be used to build a parking deck and expand the convention center, which sits across from the project

[dubone]

Just to clarify, that money would be used to build a parking deck and expand the convention center, which sits across from the project

[Raintree21]

They didn't specify in the News14 story. They just said the funds would expand the convention center and build the parking deck. I don't really see where the convention center would expand to. It's border by streets on 3 sides and sidewalk/park/sitting area on another.

[UptownJ]

I thought they said that they would not expand the convention center because of low attendence... and use the money that for that to go to the nchof. Thats how I look it at least... I know the article said something about a new ball room their but I figured that was redoing something already inside the convention center.

I think the site is great... i can picture great views coming in on south blvd with this big awsome new modern hof ... I think we are ahead in our planning when compared to the other cities... but maybe they are being more hush hush about it to see what we can come up with...

We've pretty much let our plan be open for the world to see

[dubone]

this is a mystery.

i remember a big issue in the arena debate was that much of the money they were using was set aside to expand the conv center. at the time, the council didn't seem to care because it was struggle to fill its current space. it may be that now they can tap a new funding source, they are setting aside the money they had failed to set aside before.

[dubone]

For the record, here is the observer article, which explains the funding structure in more detail. (what would we do without print media).

http://www.charlotte.com/mld/charlotte/spo...ts/11429620.htm

[atlrvr]

Ok.....I think I can help on this one.......the convention center will be expanded by adding one more ball room on the site where the HOF is proposed. What the convention center really wants to do is close Brevard between Stonewall and 2nd (and go ahead 2-way Brevard between 2nd and Trade)........C-DOT supports this, but the biggest obstacle will be the Brevard/South/277 interchange. The have a long term plan to fix it, but I'm not sure if there is enough money to do it soon enough.

If they do not close it, a sky-bridge would be built across Brevard and the ball room, parking deck, and HOF would all be on the proposed site.

[dubone]

i sure hope they keep brevard. i wouldn't mind just one lane in each direction, closed for pedestrian use-only during conventions, but why on earth kill the grid even more just to avoid having a skybridge!

by keeping 2 lanes of road, it could stay one way until the other changes are made (it would have only 2 lanes in that direction in the 2-way caldwell scenario, too).

that does clear it up, though.

Are they anticipating the HOF to be the whole 2 block section between stonewall and 2nd, or just the south half?

[atlrvr]

I don't know on that one......though I would imagine the HOF to be close to 2nd, and the parking deck to be close to Stonewall.

[dubone]

some of the stories are saying the "site" is 3 acres, which would just be a single block. i know a 2nd street location would put more blocks nearby for economic development, but i kind of hope that it could go by stonewall, to be a gateway into downtown.

[Rickydavisfan21]

I mean it would kinda make sense for the gateway to this city to me nascar but I wouldn't wanna see it. I mean yes Nascar is an extremely profitable business (notice how I don't say sport, because nascar, nba, nfl, they are all businesses, and very wonderfully structured businesses I might add), but I just don't want it to be a gateway to the city

[dubone]

i just mean that a (hopefully) impressive 140 million dollar tourist attraction designed by IM Pei with 400,000 visitors per year should in a noticeable location that serves to welcome people to downtown. Sure nascar has a bit of an image problem for some (many) people, but hey, if we are spending that much on the place, let it be in a prominent location.

again, this is assuming it will be impressive looking... otherwise, put the thing in concord.

[eastsider]

An update on the competition.

The Daytona Beach News-Journal released the results of a study done by Fishkind & Associates stating that the nascar HOF would attract just over 400,000 visitors a year. This is the same number of visitors projected in Charlotte (although I haven't heard how they have arrived at that number).

Fishkind projected the hall of fame would draw 406,300 visitors a year, more than halls of fame for baseball, football or basketball.

Company officials declined to comment on the study until it is made public, but Mayor Yvonne Scarlett-Golden called the estimate "a real conservative number."

Daytona Beach officials propose building an 80,000-square-foot facility that would cost $70 million., The overall cost of the project, with interest, would be $86 million. The study anticipates paying a $1 a year to lease a site for the building on Daytona International Speedway property.

The hall of fame's income after all expenses and debt service is projected at $4.6 million in its inaugural year. That net income would drop by more than half after enthusiasm during the opening year wears off, but build back up to $2.7 million in the fifth year.

But those figures assume state support for construction -- and that's no guarantee.

The attendance breakdown:

224,700 patrons drawn just to see the hall of fame

100,000 fans in town to attend other nascar events

81,600 visitors in town for other special events

Funding breakdown:

$30 million from the state

rest to come from private donars

land from the speedway

Full story here.

[dubone]

http://www.charlotte.com/mld/charlotte/spo...ts/11458606.htm

Yvonne Szeto will be the lead architect on this project. Apparently, she is a 48 year old chinese lady who went to harvard and has never been to a nascar race. hmmm...sounds like a match made in heaven.

We'll see. I'm certain that this has a chance to be a major icon in charlotte. I hope it meets its design potential (and obviously gets built here). I like the arena design as far as how it fits into the urban streetscape, however, i agree with article that it has the 'design by committee' prevented it from becoming an icon for the city.

This has a chance.

[Miesian Corners]

Here are some of Ms. Szeto's buildings

ABN/AMRO Headquarters, Amsterdam

2099 Pennsylvania Ave, Washington

Federal Courthouse, Hammond, IN

Tour la Defense, Paris

First Bank, Minneapolis

[Raintree21]

Anybody know what the attendance numbers have been for the other Hall of Fames around the country?

[dubone]

i loved the first bank building in mn when i saw it. i know the HOF would be a completely different use, but i like her work. (not so keen on the courthouse, but i'm also sure that wouldn't be what she does with this project, so no biggie).

[eastsider]

Anybody know what the attendance numbers have been for the other Hall of Fames around the country?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

College Football Hall of Fame - South Bend, Ind. ~100,000 per year.

National Baseball Hall of Fame - Cooperstown, NY ~350,000 per year.

World Golf Hall of Fame - St. Augustine, Fla. 210,000 in 2004

Pro Football Hall of Fame - Canton, Ohio 177,539 in 2003 (highest 227,202 in 1995).

Rock & Roll Hall of Fame - Cleveland, Ohio ~500,000 per year.

[Raintree21]

So with that being said, anybody think we'll actually meet the projected 400,000 attendance that the city is proclaiming?

[peaceloveunderstanding]

I would hope we could do a better job then TOWNS like South Bend, Cooperstown, St. Augustine, and Canton. We are the only city on the list besides Cleveland, and look they attract over 500k a year. I think we get a great deal of visitors from our city itself.

[eastsider]

So with that being said, anybody think we'll actually meet the projected 400,000 attendance that the city is proclaiming?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think we will get to the 400,000 mark (especially in the first couple of years). The advantage Charlotte will have are three "speedweeks" each year which already draw thousand's of people to town. The other sports hof's do not have teams that play in the cities in which they are located so the largest draw is when they have an induction ceremony. I'm not sure if St. Augustine has a golf tounament, but even so it is only one week a year.

On top of this, I read an interview from one of the France family members recently and they stateded the technology and broadcasting components were going to be major elements of the hof. I think if they can keep fresh exhibits on the technology side, it may be more appealling to non-nascar fans.

Then of course there are the regional factors such as have 90% of the race teams located in the area and the driving experience school at the speedway that will draw people throughout the year.