Charlotte's SkyScraper Boom

[A2]

LA MSA does not include SD, though give them about 15 years and they may.

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haha this is true....

[RiversideGator]

no offense but I think that city numbers are really irrelevant

I think they are mostly irrelevent too, except for bragging rights. However, it does help to have a larger city size when you look at accomplishing large projects, like building a new football stadium, because a larger city has the financial ability to get it done whereas a small city within a larger metro of competing cities may not. Given the choice, I would rather have a large city population than a small city and the same sized metro area.

[Viper]

A perfect example of this is Virginia Beach.

Even LA competes with the smaller cities around it for things.

[krazeeboi]

I think that the urbanized area definition more accurately reflects the true size of a city. MSA's really only come into play when you're looking at available work force.

[spectacle21]

LA MSA does not include SD, though give them about 15 years and they may.

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i agree with you on that...hell, Southern California might as well be Los Angeles.

[monsoon]

At one time it was considered as such and LA was officially the largest city in the USA.

[catdaddy]

my grandfather did tell me that LA was the biggest city at one point in time

[QLawrence]

According to Emporis, which has been slacking as of late, 2 under construction.

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Charlotte is now underconstuction with The Avenue according to Emporis

and im sure most of you already know this.

[AmericanUrbanDesigner]

I think that the urbanized area definition more accurately reflects the true size of a city. MSA's really only come into play when you're looking at available work force.

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I completely disagree. It is the goal of places like Huntersville, Davidson, Cornelius, etc. in the Charlotte region to maintain rural areas on the edges of their cores (to help support rail transit) even though these areas may border Charlotte itself. What this does, in essence, is break-up contiguous stretches of development into concentrated nodes. It does not diminish their association with Charlotte however!

If "urbanized" areas were the rule for determining the "true size" of a city, the population of a European "behemoth" like Berlin would be greatly diminished because Berlin, the City (merged with "Greater Berlin" in 1920, encompasses many urban areas, truly just a collection of nodes (some huge, some tiny - even farming communities) that are not contiguously developed.

[Spartan]

I completely disagree.  It is the goal of places like Huntersville, Davidson, Cornelius, etc. in the Charlotte region to maintain rural areas on the edges of their cores (to help support rail transit) even though these areas may border Charlotte itself.  What this does, in essence, is break-up contiguous stretches of development into concentrated nodes.  It does not diminish their association with Charlotte however!

If "urbanized" areas were the rule for determining the "true size" of a city, the population of a European "behemoth" like Berlin would be greatly diminished because Berlin, the City (merged with "Greater Berlin" in 1920, encompasses many urban areas, truly just a collection of nodes (some huge, some tiny - even farming communities) that are not contiguously developed.

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No. Here in America, the MSA accounts for the commuting patterns that you just described. The UA puts cities on the same level. Besides, the UA statistic is at the county level, so you wont see the distinction that you are referring to, except a disconnected area on a map.

[cityboi]

I'm jealous of Charlotte's skyline growth But seriously, I'm proud that North Carolina has a city that stands tall with cities such as Atlanta and Nashville

The image below also shows that Charlotte will no longer have a linear skyline where there is a concetration of towers on Tryon. The only thing thats missing in this aerial drawing is a major league baseball stadium! I also think Charlotte should expand the size of its convention center so it can better compete with the Georgia World Congress Center in downtown Atlanta.

[Sabaidee]

Urgh em surface lots. But 12 surface lots are disappearing now. The Arena takes 4 away, then Trademark and Courtside, 1 each. Wachovia will take up 2. The 3rd Ward park will take away 3. Yes!!! Yea Charlotte's skyline development are moving on Trade St for once, it will be develop into a cross shaped. Vue and Trademark in the vicinity of Trade.

[QueenCityBoy]

I like all of our new skyrises. It's crazy to think the city is building all of this in the next few years. 3 years from now i will not even reconize my own city.

[Newnan]

Good for Charlotte, Atlanta is experiencing a condo and residential tower boom as well

[Newnan]

You are an embarassment to all Charlotteans on this board.

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[Newnan]

I'm jealous of Charlotte's skyline growth   But seriously, I'm proud that North Carolina has a city that stands tall with cities such as Atlanta and Nashville

The image below also shows that Charlotte will no longer have a linear skyline where there is a concetration of towers on Tryon. The only thing thats missing in this aerial drawing is a major league baseball stadium! I also think Charlotte should expand the size of its convention center so it can better compete with the Georgia World Congress Center in downtown Atlanta.

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Why do you want to compete with Atlanta?

[Newnan]

I agree, Television markets do not use them at all. I feel as though a region helps to identify the true urban population.

One example that stands out bigger than any is ATL. There MSA is comprised of well over 20 counties, whereas cities such as CLT, Nashville, B'ham are not. That is an argument that could go on and on and on. But for the sake of debate I will explain.

There are parts of Atlanta that are over an hours drive from dtwn proper. (Gainsville and Lawrenceville) and 400 seems to go on forever. However it is included in ATL's MSA. If that were the case for many other cities wouldn't their Metro's stand out??? If I drive an hour up the road I run striaght into Winston-Salem and Greensboro. (over 1.4 Million in their metro). We are talking around a 60-70 mile drive from my driveway. If we included it with Metro Charlotte, you would have a number of over 4 Million !

That is why it is sometimes hard to compare cities. You have to stick with the definitions. But sometimes the definitions are skewed. Look at LA. How many towns and counties is that metro comprised of. Last I heard LA sometimes incorporates San Diego in there #'s...(that is the nations 6th largest city for crying out loud)

Here is a link:

Look at the shear size of it...

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=htt...6lr%3D%26sa%3DN

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I know this in my fourth post, but I had to butt in. Lawrenceville is not an hour away from downtown Atlanta and Hall County (Gainesville) hall County is not even in Atlanta's MSA

[up+down=midtown]

what southern city isn't booming?

[Plasticman]

what southern city isn't booming?

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That is quite a boom. I wonder how many actually will get built. Even if half of them get built, that would be great!!!

[krazeeboi]

what southern city isn't booming?

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Several.

[krazeeboi]

I also think Charlotte should expand the size of its convention center so it can better compete with the Georgia World Congress Center in downtown Atlanta.

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Why? The convention business in the U.S. isn't exactly profitable these days.

[Lady Celeste]

Why? The convention business in the U.S. isn't exactly profitable these days.

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I don't know about that Krazeeboi. Las Vegas, Orlando, Atlanta, Chicago and New Orleans would probably have begged to differ. Major conventions pump millions and millions of dollars into your local economy.

[teshadoh]

I don't know about that Krazeeboi. Las Vegas, Orlando, Atlanta, Chicago and New Orleans would probably have begged to differ. Major conventions pump millions and millions of dollars into your local economy.

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Yet despite the increased size of Atlanta's convention center, it has taken a sever beating from Las Vegas & other cities where in the past it had a formidable position. My concern is that it has been a great asset to the city, but just as banks have been viewed as Charlotte's bread & butter while Atlanta has depended heavily on tourism business (I know it may be a shock to some). Of course the convention business is just one of Atlanta's economic engines - yet it has required the state & city a great effort to yearly regain those audiences

On the other hand - it has also meant more expenditures have been made on downtown than it would normally. But then again - the majority of that development has been tourist based, rather than trying to supplement Atlanta's growing downtown residential population. Lastly, being in downtown during the day - I can vouch that many of those pig farmers or hair stylists that come to town for conventions tend to annoy me

[Lady Celeste]

Lastly, being in downtown during the day - I can vouch that many of those pig farmers or hair stylists that come to town for conventions tend to annoy me

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Did you say PIG FARMERS!!!!!

You are silly, lol.

You are right Teshadoh.....Atlanta's convention industry has come under extreme competion from Las Vegas and Orlando specifically but not speaking city specific, convention business can be profitable overall.

The Megafest that was here in early August had a reported 150,000+ attendees and they are reported to have spent a per person average of $1000. This total includes hotel, car rental (where applicable), food and shopping. That's a whopping $150,000,000 being pumped into the local economy. Imagine how many hotel and restaurant workers got a little extra during this four day event. Conventions also are a way to showcase the city. Especially when you have professional organizations hold their events here. I'm quite out out that we lost the Comdex (sp?) convention years ago.

Continue my city specific discussion, I hope that Atlanta doesn't rely too much on tourism. After 9/11 and during the recent economic downturn, tourism was a very hard hit industry. Hotels have just recently starting their comeback with occupancy rates. Hopefully CAD, the mayor and other civic leaders will understand that Atlanta is not just for tourist but for families as well. That's why I was a tad bit skeptical about the location of the proposed Nascar HOF. We don't want the Olympic Park area to become an area that closes with the tourist attractions. Oddly enough the Georgia World Congress Center (GWCC) would be across the park from the HOF.

Perhaps that's why the propose location was suggested......I think it would behoove the powers that be to add as much residential in the Centennial Park area as possible. Then again maybe they don't want to subject the local residents to pig farmers and hair stylist.

Sorry guys......we went sooooooooo far away from discussing Charlotte's skyscraper boom........which I must say is remarkable. Charlotte is like a beautiful model putting on a great Valentino outfit.....beauty upon beauty. It only gets better.

[krazeeboi]

I don't know about that Krazeeboi. Las Vegas, Orlando, Atlanta, Chicago and New Orleans would probably have begged to differ. Major conventions pump millions and millions of dollars into your local economy.

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An excerpt from the Brookings Institute report, "Space Available: The Realities of Convention Centers as Economic Development Strategy":

The overall convention marketplace is declining in a manner that suggests that a recovery or turnaround is unlikely to yield much increased business for any given community, contrary to repeated industry projections. Moreover this decline began prior to the disruptions of 9-11 and is exacerbated by advances in communications technology. Currently, overall attendance at the 200 largest tradeshow events languishes at 1993 levels.

Here's an article from USAToday.com which speaks of the convention business in Atlanta in particular. Perhaps some heavily tourist-oriented areas, such as Las Vegas and Orlando, buck against this trend, but overall, the convention business, specifically convention centers, isn't quite as profitable as it has been in times past.

At any rate, I see no need for Charlotte to expand its convention center in order to "better compete" with the Georgia World Congress Center. That place is massive.