Uptown Charlotte Street and Sidewalk Plans

[atlrvr]

Uptown transportation improvements.

Here are some of the updates to Uptown's transportation plan

1. Brevard and Trade will become signature pedestrian streets and received the same streetscape treatments at Tryon.

2. Brevard, Mint, and Poplar will become 2-way their entire length. (Brevard just north of the arena)

3. There will be a pedestrian bridge over the train tracks where 9th street is, but 9th street will be closed to traffic.

4. Davidson will be extended from 2nd to Stonewall and aligned with the I-277 exit there.

5. The Stonewall ramp to I-277 will be modified to require a right hand turn rather than a separate lane.

6. Myers will be extended from 6th to 7th.

7. 3rd may be closed where the 3rd Ward park is proposed (4th may become 2-way for several blocks)

8. There is consideration for extending 2nd street under the rail lines to connect with Cedar.

[eastsider]

I really like the idea of extending 2nd to cedar and pedestrain improvements.

[dubone]

I am busting with happiness right now.... are these certainties? (what is the source?)

I have thought about and hoped for about half of these changes!.

- I think that Tryon-style pedestrian amenties on Brevard will MAKE that the shopping district planned for the Levine District.

- Making those streets two way will make a major difference to the usefulness of those streets. I also hope that these changes will elimate the arch-connectors in third ward, as they are so silly, and really detract from the development potential of some of those blocks.

- I had known about the extension of davidson, but i know i will use it all the time, instead of mcdowell to get to dilworth. I often take it to 2nd and then shimmy around, but it will make such a difference to be able to get all the way to stonewall, i believe.

Basically, i'm so happy that CDOT is making efforts to rebuild the grid system as it was 50-100 years ago, when downtown was thriving. By reconnecting the lost grid connectors, converting low-volume streets back to two-way, and making serious pedestrian amenities on key corridors will make such a major difference to uptown liveability (and shopability ).

[atlrvr]

Well....the Davidson St. extension is the first to happen. It will coincide with the completion of Metro School. Brevard will become two way north of the arena, but I really can't give a time frame, but I would say less than 2 years.......as far as the streetscape there, I'm sure as Levine begins to develop his land (don't laugh) it will happen. Trade will start the streetscaping to coincide with the streetcar proposal.

The pedestrian bridge at 9th won't happen until track work for the new station is almost complete. 3rd St. will be severed once park construction begins. 2nd street is the least likely to happen (though eveyone wants it) If it does happen, it will coincide with the construction of the new train station.

As far as poplar and pine, I don't have any clue as to when this would happen, but a CDOT did confirm last month that it is planned.....

Oh yeah, and Myers would coincide with the Renwick.

[Norm2]

the ciy really does need to reconnect its grid system uptown, all of these roads are being cut off now for the arena and parks and stuff.

[Miesian Corners]

I'm curious how these changes will affect interchanges on the Brookshire. Especially Brevard and Caldwell streets.

The city should also reconnect Myers St from 6th to 5th (at the Police Station). Land is vacant right now anyway and it's city owned.

[dubone]

I'm curious how these changes will affect interchanges on the Brookshire.  Especially Brevard and Caldwell streets. 

The city should also reconnect Myers St from 6th to 5th (at the Police Station).  Land is vacant right now anyway and it's city owned.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[Raintree21]

Charlotte DOT seeks input on future of Uptown

The Charlotte Department of Transportation (CDOT) hosted a workshop on Wednesday so local residents could see its plans for Charlotte

[atlrvr]

I went and there was some pretty fascinating stuff there. Most of it I have already mentioned before on here, but there were a few additions. Caldwell will eventually become 2-lanes all the way through downtown, and essentially will become the same street as South Blvd., while Brevard will dead-end into Stonewall. Euclid will eventually cross 277 and become Davidson St.....5th St. will add a lane under 277 that does not merge into Independence but continue up to Kings. There are also numerous reworkings of the 277 exit ramps, but it is hopeless to try and explain them. Also, 11th/McDowell will become 2-way as it follows 277 through 1st Ward. After full implementation of the plan, the only streets remaining 1-way in uptown are College, Church, 3rd, 4th, 5th, and 6th.

They also want to approve new minimum sidewalk widths, based on a heirarchy of pedestrian streets. Essentially every new development in Uptown would have to allow for a minimum 14 sidewalk.......some streets such as 5th that have dangerously narrow sidewalks would eliminate on-street parking so that the sidewalks could be widened.

[peaceloveunderstanding]

consitent sidewalk size would be great.

[ElricSeven]

I went and there was some pretty fascinating stuff there.  Most of it I have already mentioned before on here, but there were a few additions.  Caldwell will eventually become 2-lanes all the way through downtown, and essentially will become the same street as South Blvd., while Brevard will dead-end into Stonewall.  Euclid will eventually cross 277 and become Davidson St.....5th St. will add a lane under 277 that does not merge into Independence but continue up to Kings.  There are also numerous reworkings of the 277 exit ramps, but it is hopeless to try and explain them.  Also, 11th/McDowell will become 2-way as it follows 277 through 1st Ward.  After full implementation of the plan, the only streets remaining 1-way in uptown are College, Church, 3rd, 4th, 5th, and 6th.

They also want to approve new minimum sidewalk widths, based on a heirarchy of pedestrian streets.  Essentially every new development in Uptown would have to allow for a minimum 14 sidewalk.......some streets such as 5th that have dangerously narrow sidewalks would eliminate on-street parking so that the sidewalks could be widened.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Caldwell's already two lanes, or do you mean two lanes in both direction (i.e., a total of four lanes?

[dubone]

"Caldwell will eventually become 2-lanes all the way through downtown, and essentially will become the same street as South Blvd."

I assume you mean, 2-ways. i have always thought this should happen eventually, but i wonder how they will solve the block between 3rd and 4th, which narrows by The Park site, Charlotte National Bldg and the the city/county parking deck.

"Euclid will eventually cross 277 and become Davidson St"

I have mentioned the need for this a few times on these forums. this makes me VERY happy, as it will finally reconnect dilworth to 2nd ward in that part of town. This is great news.

"5th St. will add a lane under 277 that does not merge into Independence but continue up to Kings."

oh my gosh. you are pretty much stating my wish list for changes!!!! I have thought this should happen for many years. not only does this mean you don't accidentally get stuck getting on independence, but it also allows you to take 5th street quite a long way through elizabeth, which should help ease traffice on 7th, and reconnect uptown even more.

"There are also numerous reworkings of the 277 exit ramps, but it is hopeless to try and explain them."

Do you at least remember which exits they were? i'm a junky for this stuff. HEre is my wishlist:

- Remove the loopy exit between 3rd and 4th behind four pts sheraton. That exit should empty straight ahead onto 3rd, with dedicated lanes for cars to make 3 90 degree left turns to get to 4th. the current setup is RIDICULOUS to drive to get to 3rd, and wastes so much prime land.

- Remove the loopy exit from northbound south blvd to westbound belk. have cars go right on stonewall and then right onto a quarter-arc entrance ramp.

- knowing that they'll kill the brevard to south connection, i hope they convert the loop exit from westbound belk to south bound south into a quarter-arc exit that aligns to brevard. that way cars can go straight on a 2-way brevard, right or left to stonewall, and double right to south.

- somehow lengthen the two ramps from eastbound belk onto 11th.

"Also, 11th/McDowell will become 2-way as it follows 277 through 1st Ward."

This one puzzles me. Not only do I not fully picture how this will work, but i don't really agree with it. Do you if they are just talking about the section east of davidson (which is fine) or the whole stretch of 11th (most of 11th is in 1st ward)

"After full implementation of the plan, the only streets remaining 1-way in uptown are College, Church, 3rd, 4th, 5th, and 6th."

this will go a LONG way to making the one way system easy to follow and keep up with. these particular one way streets are so vital to traffic capacity, i wouldn't want to see them converted. Brevard/Caldwell pair was totally messed up by the arena, but it will be a net gain to have brevard a low capacity pedestrian street and caldwell being the extension of south blvd in people's minds.

"They also want to approve new minimum sidewalk widths, based on a heirarchy of pedestrian streets. Essentially every new development in Uptown would have to allow for a minimum 14 sidewalk.......some streets such as 5th that have dangerously narrow sidewalks would eliminate on-street parking so that the sidewalks could be widened."

That is interesting, and will go a long way to longterm viability of the pedestrian infrastructure.

I am so happy about each and every one of these changes. Maybe it seems a bit lame, but i guess i'm the personality type that zeroes in on areas needing improvement, and these (along with your previous list) really list almost all the changes i could think to list!

The only things i really have left (reconnecting the alexader, myers and 1st street throughout the grid) are called for in the 2nd Ward Plan and would likely be required or done as development starts to occur in there. It would also be nice to reconnect 10th as much as possible in 1st ward, as part of hal marshal redev.

[Norm2]

1st street almost doenst evne exist in uptown except for the small piece of it in 3rd Ward. I actually didnt even know it existed until Wachovia started making plans to built a new tower at 1st and Tryon. It will be nice to see a gride pattern return to the 2nd ward area eventually.....whenever development takes off in that area. Will probably take another decade or so I am sure for anything to seriously happen there.

[dubone]

1st is still around in 3rd ward was of the stadium. Also, it continues to be widdled away. It used to also go between tryon and college, but was removed as part of the Green. I really would not be surprised if wachovia's eventual plans for the tower at 1st and tryon actually calls for abandonment of 1st street there.

the convention center seems to pay homage to 1st street by its alignment of the main east-west entrance and walkway corridor. In 2nd ward, 1st street went through the center of (the old Brooklyn community). But i'm not sure there is hope for reconnecting much of it through there anymore. 2nd runs further south than it should east of caldwell and metro school being built all the way from stonewall to 2nd.

,aybe they should just abandon the remaining 1st street and rename stonewall .

[Raintree21]

I hope they fix the 4th street exit where you have to do a U-turn to get onto 3rd street. It is always backed up and you have to fight people turning left from 4th. That was definitely a design screw up.

[atlrvr]

Ok......here are the exits that I can remember will be rearranged.

The famous 3rd/4th street exit will work as follows:

The right ramp lane will curve right in a continuous manner and go under 277 and connect to 4th street between 277 and the 3rd/4th street connector. To head outbound on 4th will then only require a 90 degree left-hand turn.

The Caldwell/Brevard/277 interesection:

Like I mentioned, Brevard will dead-end into Stonewall, and Caldwell/South will be two-way across the existing north-bound bridge. Additionally the Stonewall exit that will initially connect to the Davidson extension will be removed. The 277 access lane that provides on/off ramps will be graded upwards to make a 4-way intersection with a traffic light at Caldwell and then graded back down to rejoin 277. People travelling eastbound on 277 who want to go south on South Blvd will travel under Caldwell/South and horseshoe back and connect with a new stop light........did all of that make sense?

The horrible 12th street weave will not be improved, nor will the 11th street on-ramp at 277 that now allows very short amount of space to merge to Independence.

There are also modications to the ramps at college/brevard, but I don't remember exactly how they worked.

All the 2nd Ward plans are still expected to occur......anything else?

[Norm2]

When are some of these road projects supposed to start? Within the next year or so i hope?

[monsoon]

Did they happen to mention where the funding was coming from to make these changes?

[Miesian Corners]

Did they happen to mention where the funding was coming from to make these changes?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

From what they said at the meeting, land freed up by the changes to the South Blvd interchange (nearly four square blocks) will be sold to pay for a good bit of the improvements. Some changes get paid for through the State and Federal dot. Some are part of the new multi-modal station (connecting 2nd St to Cedar).

HNTB did a really great job on this, as did city staff. Kudos to them both. Everything actually made sense.

[nyxmike]

Did they happen to mention where the funding was coming from to make these changes?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

There is an article today in the Observer about it...

http://www.charlotte.com/mld/charlotte/news/11389202.htm

They said some will take about 25 years because there is no funding... Others will be underway soon, like the I-277 Kenilworth Ave. interchange, and some just require new paint and signs.

[Raintree21]

The article also answers my question about 4th street.

A convoluted interchange that forces Interstate 277 drivers to make a U-turn on Fourth Street so they can reach Third would be untangled in a proposal to redo several uptown streets and exits.

The proposal calls for a new ramp that would take traffic directly to Third Street, transportation planner Howard Landers told 30 uptown workers Wednesday during a workshop on proposed street and freeway changes.

That interchange on the east end of uptown is a headache during morning rush hour. Its offramp empties onto one-way Fourth Street, with no direct access to Third. Drivers heading to Third must make a U-turn on Fourth, including the occasional drivers who can't make that turn without stopping and backing up into heavy Fourth Street traffic.

[uptownliving]

The 5th St sidewalks are really dangerous. They can't widen them soon enough. Having drunk people coming out of the bars on 5th onto very thin sidewalks right next to a highly traveled road is a disaster waiting to happen.

[dubone]

this is all great news.

The loopy exits waste so much land. And that uturn is not only THE freeway exit to get to myers park and eastover, etc., but it is also the route of nc16!

I'm still not totally clear on whether they will still use the loop around to 4th, but a new ramp to go straight to 3rd. I'll reread the article later, but i'm not sure they specified whether the change is additive or a replacement.

The South blvd/277 interchange idea is very cool. I like the idea of killing off all the loopies and half-arcs around there and moving to a simple intersection. It will be SOOOO much easier to explain and understand.

As far as funding--- now that they are on the official wishlist, funding has a chance. It make take some time, but in the scheme of things regionally, they aren't going to be that expensive. they may even be able to come sooner because the state often delays the large expensive projects, leaving room for the less expensive projects to come sooner. Many of these will easily be able to fit into the city's transportation budget long before 2025, anyway. if the state keeps them on the bottom of their list for too long, these are important enough to the city, that they will still happen soon.

As i've said before, I am much more for investing in these types of improvements to help move pedestrians and cars in and around downtown than for removing the loop and hoping that the 19th century development patterns will return.

[atlrvr]

dubone.....let me try again on the 3rd/4th street ramp.........essentially nothing will be removed from the current set-up except the cut-out to allow the u-turn would be removed and u-turns would become illegal.

As it is now, the right exit ramp lane intersects with 4th for a left hand turn only. The right lane will no longer connect to 4th, but instead curve east UNDER 277 and continue this curve until it makes a direct connection with 3rd, between 277 and the 1-way connector on the EAST SIDE of 277.......this allows for a simple left hand turn onto 3rd street.

This is truly an execptional plan, and solves almost every dangerous car vs. human movement that exists in Uptown.

[dubone]

i can see now how their design will work. i guess i still think it is a bit bizarre because they route 4th street in the opposite direction of the current street flow.

I wonder why they can't do the exact opposite, and connect that exit to a T intersection with 3rd. Cars going to 4th could easily use the existing 3rd to 4th connector between 277 and little sugar creek to get to 4th. by dedicating the left lanes along that path, it could easily handle the inbound traffic.

i guess my idea operates on the premise the uturn exit loops do not belong in urban environments.