Uptown Charlotte Street and Sidewalk Plans

[atlrvr]

There will still be a few u-turns (Westbound 277 from eastbond Stonewall, Southbound South from Eastboudn 277, and then the eastbound 4th from southbound 277) I don't think it's a big problem though because non will be high-speed interchanges and will all intersect at a light in a perpendicular manner.

[dubone]

i know a few will uturn ramps will remain anyway.

i guess i'm just thinking that interchange could be so much simpler if they just empty to 3rd and make 4th traffic shimy around.

Here is a drawing:

[atlrvr]

I think the problem with this is that the heavy morning traffic would back up the 3rd/4th connector, but I'm not sure. The nice thing about their design is that it doesn't put any additional traffic on the existing road network, in fact it reduces it.

[dubone]

but if they can add new dedicated lanes clockwise for 3rd street traffic, they can just as easily add new dedicated lanes counter clockwise for 4th street traffic.

honestly, i'll probably be happy with the eventual design. i just hope they don't over-complicate it.

[Raintree21]

I'm guessing that Dubone's drawing is kinda like the way Providence and Randolph merge to form 4th Street. Only problem is, I don't know if there's enough room for people to merge before the light (like people do trying to get onto East and West 277) if they want to get over. It could be a traffic nightmare. I wonder if they would do a flyover for the 3rd street exit and keep the 4th street exit, just ban U-turns.

[dubone]

I'm guessing that Dubone's drawing is kinda like the way Providence and Randolph merge to form 4th Street.  Only problem is, I don't know if there's enough room for people to merge before the light (like people do trying to get onto East and West 277) if they want to get over. It could be a traffic nightmare.  I wonder if they would do a flyover for the 3rd street exit and keep the 4th street exit, just ban U-turns.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

no chance of a flyover...not enough room, money, or need.

I'm not totally seeing the comparison of providence and randolph, though. those streets merge to head the same direction. this would basically create a 4 way intersection: 277 exit, 3rd, 277 entrance. There is already an intersection at that point, so there would be no net new issue with merging before lights or anything. all the other parts of my design are existing roads, possibly with a new lane (4th street traffic would follow the existing 1 way around the block. )

[ElricSeven]

"The federal government will let Charlotte and North Carolina raise $20 million by selling about 11 acres at a reconfigured interchange on Interstate 277, he said. Just a few days ago, that had seemed unlikely."

http://www.charlotte.com/mld/charlotte/spo...ks/11750123.htm

Which interchange are they referring to and any speculation as to what could, or would, be done with the land?

[DigitalSky]

It's near Caldwell St, for the Nascar Hall of Fame bid

[atlrvr]

I think this would be on the Uptown side of the South Blvd connector......the only way to transform this intersection into a diamond is to make Caldwell 2-way and eliminate the Brevard connection.....perhaps the museuem will even be built across Brevard and people will have to use 2nd to get to Caldwell to get to South.

This would free up large amount of land at Davidson (which would also be eliminated) and Brevard. Who knows what the potential use could be, but a hotel seems logical...possibly some residential around where the Davidson ramp currently is.

[fulcrumsf]

Here's an altered Google map for visualization purposes.

[atlrvr]

Ok....now imagine that the exit ramp from the bottom right hand (that current T's into Stonewall) was instead extneded straight up to the South Blvd Connector with a stop-light, and then continued across and back down to 277 (instead of the on rmap from Brevard).......plus everything in the yellow area would disapper........

Essentially all the ramps on the north side of 277 in this pic would disappear and would be replaced by 1 off ramp and 1 on ramp connecting at Caldwell/South Blvd Connector with a traffic light.

[fulcrumsf]

Im bored today, so I thought I would do a quick rendering of what it might look like to go along with what atlrvr has posted. Not sure if this is exactly how you imagined it,but I wanted everyone to be able to visualize what land can be saved.

[atlrvr]

fulcrum......actually....more than than that.....get rid of the half-loop in the bottom right hand corner, and connect it to where you have your off ramp now.....and then connect the 277 on-ramp to where the Brevard on-ramp connects.....and get rid of the half loop at the top of the screen.

[ElricSeven]

fulcrum......actually....more than than that.....get rid of the half-loop in the bottom right hand corner, and connect it to where you have your off ramp now.....and then connect the 277 on-ramp to where the Brevard on-ramp connects.....and get rid of the half loop at the top of the screen.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm probably belying my ignorance, but why have it that way in the first place if it takes up so much land?

[atlrvr]

Because the thought before was that everything needed to be a high-speed intersection and there was no real demand for Uptown land at the time......and pedestrians be damned......essentially Uptown was never seen as a place that anyone would live or visit....just as a place that people worked during the day and would take highways to get to.

[atlrvr]

fulcrum.....almost...just take out the half-loop that devides the green and tan and that's it.

[fulcrumsf]

s.....and get rid of the half loop at the top of the screen.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Are you reffering to the Bervard/277/ connector?? If so,the reason I left that in is because I think DOT would leave that access ramp in to help alleviate any traffic caused by the new Arena. But I could be wrong.

[atlrvr]

Nope.....gone.....because all traffic will be directed onto Caldwell and Brevard will be empasized as a pedestrian street (like Tryon)...there has been talk to building the NASCAR HOF and Conv. Center ontop of where Brevard currently is and Brevard would end at 2nd.....if we don't get the HOF or they build elevated across the street then Brevard will definetly dead-end at Stonewall (but become 2-way as well).

[fulcrumsf]

Nope.....gone.....because all traffic will be directed onto Caldwell and Brevard will be empasized as a pedestrian street (like Tryon)...there has been talk to building the NASCAR HOF and Conv. Center ontop of where Brevard currently is and Brevard would end at 2nd.....if we don't get the HOF or they build elevated across the street then Brevard will definetly dead-end at Stonewall (but become 2-way as well).

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Ohh, okay, should be changed,good stuff to know.

[Sabaidee]

This is going to affect how CDOT wanted to do with Davidson Street, CDOT wanted to extend Davidson across I-277 with a new bridge to connect with South End, though it won't happen for prolly 2 more decardes.

[atlrvr]

But this allows CDOT to do that....without eliminating the exit onto Caldwell, Euclid coudn't be extended....thought you're right....that extension won't happen for a long time.

[dubone]

this is great news! will this speed up the reconfig of the interchange?

will the land itself be used for spin off development for the hof, or will the hof now sit south of stonewall?

i love all the grid changes proposed here and throughout uptown. they will be a major boost to the area. this interchange is currently the worst for pedestrians.

I also hope they correct the loops on the other side of south and build a pedestrian staircase to morehead.

[atlrvr]

Also, as monsoon has pointed out in other threads, some of the large corporate buildings do not address the street with any retail.....the fact that they have a blank slate allows for a true mixed-use environment, with a solid stretch of retail from 5th to 10th.....plus it is closer to light rail than Tryon.

[UptownGrrl]

While I think it would be great to have some retail along Tryon, I really want N. Brevard to become the main shopping drag for Uptown.....but then cities with large downtowns have shopping spread out over many different shopping streets.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I agree - better to pull people off the main business street and get some pedestrian traffic in the farther reaches of first and second wards.

[dubone]

The Arena disrupted the corridor as a major traffic thoroughfare, so Caldwell will be converted to 2 directions, Brevard will get pedestrian amenties, and the South Blvd/277 interchange will be redesigned. Convention Center, HOF, CTC, Arena, Imaginon and future First Ward Park pedestrians will all be directed to that corridor. The historic structures such as Treloar, the storefronts by Grace Church, and the storefronts at Trade and Brevard will provide some older charm, while there are many blocks of vacant/semi-vacant land that the city wants to spur into action to future support those goals.