Norfolk Development

[Seven Cities]

Va. Beach city council will never accept or acknowledge Norfolk as the urban core of Hampton Roads no matter who or what comes to DT.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I agree. While I admire and applaud Va. Beach's efforts and successes with Town Center (TC), I have always felt that Norfolk has been the center city in Hampton Roads. Take a look at this region - each city (except for Chesapeake) has their own distinct downtown area, but has that ever infringed on downtown Norfolk? Hardly. Va. Beach just doesn't have the urban infrastructure that Norfolk has.

Don't take this the wrong way, I like what's going on at Town Center - creating something out of what was much of nothing is great; bringing in first-time retailers and restaurants is good for the entire area. There is no doubt TC is slowly going to become a viable alternative to DT Norfolk. However, TC still has a lot of ground to cover in order to even be on the same playing field as downtown Norfolk and its going to take some time before that happens.

-------------------------------

Ah, I just love discussions on Hampton Roads regionalism and mergers. It could happen...one day. It took decades to merge municipalities before NYC became what it is today. It would make some sense to consolidate. It would be ideal and problematic at the same time. In this region it would be extremely difficult. Each city has its own agenda.

I think that bringing back the county structure, say making this Norfolk County and putting the 7 cities underneath that umbrella, would do a lot to facilitate unification.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I like that idea. It might and it might not work, though. Remember that the state of Virginia has legislation keeping city and county jurisdiction separate from each other. There would have to be pros and cons listed, extensive disscusion and research, an amendment to the state constitution would have to pass through the General Assembly, and then it would have to go to voters in a referendum. A simple referendum to increase the sales tax to fund road projects went down in flames a few years back. Imagine how difficult it would be to get an item this complex to get approval.

That brings up another point. Compared to other states do you think Virgina is better or worse off by keeping cities and counties separated?

[rusthebuss]

We should let cities and counties work together. What i mean by urban core is to have a city that is surrounded by counties. That is what we need!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[vdogg]

That brings up another point.  Compared to other states do you think Virgina is better or worse off by keeping cities and counties separated?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thats an interesting question seven, and i honestly don't know the answer to that one. I really can't think of an example of a metro region with such fragmented authority succeeding. You need some form of common structure to address metro issues and guide regional development. I guess my answer for now would be worse off. It would be interesting to know if there is another state with a similar governmental structure so i could research this. I'm not sure if all commonwealths are like that or just Virginia.

[veverkap]

Artists Renderings of St. Paul's Place from their website.

St. Paul's Place Lofts:

St. Paul's Place Flats:

St. Paul's Place Map

[vdogg]

The only way the airport will grow is if it moves to Suffolk or Isle of Wight. There really is no land to grow on there. They need to build the airport outside of the city and have a rail into the city.  Then you might see a change in the size.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

True, but i don't know if people would really want the airport placed way out there. It's kinda out of the way.

[vdogg]

Artists Renderings of St. Paul's Place from their website.

St. Paul's Place Lofts:

St. Paul's Place Flats:

St. Paul's Place Map

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yay, another new member! . Good first post too. Welcome to the forum. B) .

[rusthebuss]

True, but i don't know if people would really want the airport placed way out there. It's kinda out of the way.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Not if you put a rail system to that location and park around the general location of where the airports is now. Park and ride the rail to the airport. Its really not that far. Most metro areas have there airports in the outskirts of the city to protect the cities from crashes. I think it will not happen because of the revenues the city receives but they could work a deal with the county where it would work out for them. The train would only take about a half an hour to get there.

[veverkap]

Yay, another new member!  . Good first post too. Welcome to the forum. B)  .

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thanks. It's good to be here. I was looking for some information on the Trader building. BTW, their URL is traderonline.com, not trader.com

Patrick

[rusthebuss]

have you viewed everything on this forum, there is alot of info about the trader building here.

[urbanvb]

The only way the airport will grow is if it moves to Suffolk or Isle of Wight. There really is no land to grow on there. They need to build the airport outside of the city and have a rail into the city.

[veverkap]

have you viewed everything on this forum, there is alot of info about the trader building here.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yep. I've been looking around. Some good info.

[rusthebuss]

I was thinking the same thing. I would hate to see the airport leaving. I recall sometime ago reading about relocating the airport way out near Franklin or something for expansion purposes but honestly I could never imagine this happening.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Lets be honest in order for it to become a great airport and let the city grow to its full potential it would have to move. We already have the navy taking a big chunk of the land and the airport takes a huge chunk of land. Just think of what they could do with that land!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Then the airport could be huge out there, i think it would benefit the entire area if it moved. I live in Norfolk and i know that it is good to be close but a rail system could solve that and it would be close to the pennisula as well.

[vdogg]

Lets be honest in order for it to become a great airport and let the city grow to its full potential it would have to move. We already have the navy taking a big chunk of the land and the airport takes a huge chunk of land. Just think of what they could do with that land!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Then the airport could be huge out there, i think it would benefit the entire area if it moved. I live in Norfolk and i know that it is good to be close but a rail system could solve that and it would be close to the pennisula  as well.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I would be afraid that if the airport moved it would draw business away as well. Companies decide to locate in a city because of its convenience. Access to ports, banks, railways, and airways is very important.

[vdogg]

Yep.

[rusthebuss]

Wow, granbystreet.com a website you're creating? If so thats awesome, it's about about time Norfolk got its own development website. I wish you all the luck in the world and if you need help locating info just let me know. I've got tons of it  .

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Norfolk already has an development website, www.norfolkdevelopment.com i think thats it. I don't think that would loose business but bring business. Alot of business probably see how small it is and that there is really no room for expansion for the airport. They could put the airport in Chesapeake or something like that.

[rusthebuss]

i'm saying we need to put it somewhere that we can expand, if va beach had not built the airport industrial park we might have had the room to expand and it would have been in both cities. Va beach would have loved that

[willy]

I feel Norfolk does a great job with the roughly 4 million people that it now serves. I think at it's current size it could easily handle another 3-4 million per year. Sure, it'll get crowded, but I think they would be alright. I just don't feel that the demand is so great that they need to tear down NIA and build some huge airport out in the middle of nowhere to serve the exact same 4-5 million people. Then it would take many years to get rail service out there. If the need or demand was there, NIA would be expanding right now. True, there are plans for a new concourse to be built and even more parking garages to help with the added demand, but a whole new airport is not going to be needed for some time.

[rusthebuss]

I feel Norfolk does a great job with the roughly 4 million people that it now serves. I think at it's current size it could easily handle another 3-4 million per year. Sure, it'll get crowded, but I think they would be alright. I just don't feel that the demand is so great that they need to tear down NIA and build some huge airport out in the middle of nowhere to serve the exact same 4-5 million people. Then it would take many years to get rail service out there. If the need or demand was there, NIA would be expanding right now. True, there are plans for a new concourse to be built and even more parking garages to help with the added demand, but a whole new airport is not going to be needed for some time.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

But when you plan you have to take in consideration that it takes years to build and what the demand will be in the future when you make decisions, not on what the airport is doing now. Also the more this area grows the more FEDEX, UPS, and other shipping companies will need space at the airport. We are getting ready to have reasons for people to come to this metro area for business.

[willy]

I see your point, if planners for this area would have thought ahead, there would be 4-5 lanes going E & W bound through our tunnels.

But, I don't think the demand is that great or you would be hearing about it a lot more. I've only seen articles how NIA has increased it's traffic month after month, not that it's bursting at it's seams and don't know what they're going to do. But, if NIA can continue to increase its traffic count by 10% each year for the next 10 years, then they should really sit down and think about what they're going to do. Because, if they continue the 10% increase year after year by 2030 NIA will be seeing roughly 10-12 million people a year. And I feel that is way more people than that airport can handle at its current size.

[rusthebuss]

But with the new cruise ship terminal and how they want to have a joint venture with the airport they should look at moving. They are trying to get people out of driving range to fly here and cruise by offering package deals. This will increase traffic, and if business keeps growing here people are going to fly into the area and fly out to other cities.

[Fruit Cove]

hey i took some pics of your area while flying over a few weeks back. i believe its norfolk but im not positive, anyway its just south of the chesapeake so it cant be much else. enjoy.

i know for a fact this is the mouth of the delaware.

oh and here is a cool satelite image of the chesapeake area.

photo of bay

[vdogg]

Those are some very nice pics

[rusthebuss]

hey i took some pics of your area while flying over a few weeks back. i believe its norfolk but im not positive, anyway its just south of the chesapeake so it cant be much else. enjoy.

i know for a fact this is the mouth of the delaware.

oh and here is a cool satelite image of the chesapeake area.

photo of bay

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

That would be Newport News

[veverkap]

Wow, is granbystreet.com a website you're creating? If so thats awesome, it's about about time Norfolk got its own development website. I wish you all the luck in the world and if you need help locating info just let me know. I've got tons of it  .

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I actually bought the domain six months ago and have been working with some business partners to put together an informational/sales website for that street. Keep your eye on it in the future.

Patrick

[vdogg]

I actually bought the domain six months ago and have been working with some business partners to put together an informational/sales website for that street.  Keep your eye on it in the future.

Patrick

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hmm...interesting. You wouldn't be connected to the Granby towers project at all, would you? I talked to someone at the developers office the other day and they said they are currently working on a website and that it would be up in fairly short order.