Charlotte's Urban Lowe's Home Improvement

[orulz]

Looks great to me. I think I finally understand what everything is now (I didn't really get the "outdoor living center" before.)

There's one comment on page 3 that I don't understand. It says "note: proposed building setback is 32(?) from proposed b.o.c. along South Boulevard for the mixed-use building located in parcel B."

First of all, what is a "B.O.C.," and second, do they have a 32" setback or a 32' setback? I can't tell. A 32' setback could only be described as 'un-urban'. A 32" setback from the sidewalk would be just about right, but 32" from the curb would leave too little space for a sidewalk.

[dubone]

i don't know what boc is... but the 32 feet would be correct. parcel B is the corner of south and magnolia, and they show a large plaza at that corner, so 32' would be the depth of the plaza.

[atlrvr]

Typically it would be "back of curb" and they are referring to the distance between the curb and the street centerline.....so that sounds about right at 32'.

Actually after rereading what their post says and dubone's post....the building would be 32' from back of curb.

[monsoon]

Has this project been approved by they city yet?

[monsoon]

Opps nevermind. I just read above. sorry

[MZT]

Once this is approved it should stir interest in the other lots nearby.

Right now when I drive down South Blvd, I'll ask myself "where does the redevelopment... end?" It's still hard to hold that feeling all the way to the townhouses on New Bern... They feel isolated out there. Too much derelect junk remains in between.

The old dry cleaner's place, at Ideal and South, is an especially distracting eyesore.

[dubone]

I see lowe's as reinvigorating retail on that stretch of south boulevard. It started with Off Broadway, but momentum from there was fairly low... the project next door to obsw has had a sign and rendering for years, but no movement. now there are for sale/for lease signs across iverson from the proposed lowes, and there is that Mac's a couple blocks down.

The area has been junky for years, and couldn't even sustain the gas station at ideal and south. With 3030 south, HHHunt's apartment community, being built south of ideal, and all the work related to the light rail that will certainly revitalize the area around clanton/scaleybark, i believe it is imminent for the southernmost section of south end to be rebuilt.

[dubone]

http://www.charlotte.com/mld/charlotte/business/12649222.htm

DCDA has approved the lowe's, which almost certainly means that the council will approve it on monday, even with possible protests.

for those of us that want an urban lowe's home improvement on south blvd, this is great news.

[MZT]

There have been some backhoes and a storage unit parked next to the old Dry Cleaner's site the past few days. I'm wondering if anything is taking place there... or if the CATS contractors are just parking some of their equiment during the road construction...

[dubone]

the public hearing was last night. i forgot that the council doesn't vote yet for approval/denial until weeks after the public hearing. Most everything was already covered in the paper or on this thread.... but the one thing i thought that was interesting that came out last night was that as part of bigbox vacancy mitigation, Lowe's agreed not to prevent a competitor from taking over the building, which is historically a big problem with big boxes like walmart, where they maintain the building as vacant for a long time in order to shut out competitors.

[NCMike1981]

that's definately a good thing, empty big boxes aren't nice to look at...

[dubone]

i must say that i am pretty impressed with how this thing turned out. and it was said last night, and deserves to be repeated... normally to bring a national retailer into this type of density would require some subsidies, but in this case, lowe's has basically footing the bill, which is roughly double, in order to build a flagship urban store.

also, does anyone know any more about the underground stormwater system they are talking about? is it basically a treatment machine hooked up to storm gutters, or is like an underground pond or something?

[orulz]

does anyone know any more about the underground stormwater system they are talking about?  is it basically a treatment machine hooked up to storm gutters, or is like an underground pond or something?

You may already know this, but...

If what you are talking about is simply underground, on-site stormwater detention, this is a common practice. In developments with large amounts of impervious surface and no space for a detention pond, they build a detention tank underground. The idea is to retain on-site as much of the water from a rainstorm as possible, until the rain stops or eases, when the tank/pond can drain gradually into the storm sewer. This prevents storm drains from overflowing in modest storms. But when a real gullywasher comes through and overwhelms the detention tank/pond, then any more rain that falls gets discharged straight into the storm sewer. Even in that case you never end up dumping more water into the storm sewer than what is falling at that moment, so you're no worse off than if you didn't have the tank.

If this is actually an underground, on-site, stormwater TREATMENT facility, that's basically unheard of, because to the best of my knowledge nobody treats their stormwater, much less on-site.

[dubone]

If this is actually an underwater, on-site, stormwater TREATMENT facility, that's basically unheard of, because to the best of my knowledge nobody treats their stormwater, much less on-site.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

they implied that it was something NEW (and possibly unheard of), and was intended to act as a model for future projects. they indicated that tests would be done on the output in order to see how well it was doing. from those sentences i had the impression that it was actually doing something to the storm water (perhaps just a basic treatment like chemicals/enzymes to breakdown the oil and gas that enters the stormwater from parking lots)

[dubone]

i don't see anything about this (other than simply underground retention as you mentioned is common) in the latest zoning site plan, so maybe i was mistaken.

[atlrvr]

MC knows a guy who I believe treats stormwater that is retained in a underground cistern on-site.....the company is up in Oakboro I believe, but most of their projects have been outside the country.....apparantly a lot of permitting departments are skeptical....

[atlrvr]

I believe this is a link to the company that provides the products and services.

http://www.braewater.com/

I can't determine if they collected rainwater can be used as drinking water. Several places it says unpotable, though different sections idicated additional filtration that allows the water to serve "all" water needs.

[DigitalSky]

http://www.wsoctv.com/news/5034048/detail.html SouthEnd Closer To Getting Lowe's Store

[monsoon]

The vote on allowing this store, I believe, is supposed to take place tonight.

Rather than be an shoe in as originally expected, The Dilworth Homeowners Association has changed its mind and come out against the plan. I think they voted it down last night, so one can assume the pressure will be on the councilpeople to vote against the rezoning.

And even the very booster positive Observer has put a rather dunning editorial cartoon in today's printed paper indicating that Lowes would be bad for the area and will hurt the plan to get people onto the LRT. They referred to it as "Big Box Retail". (in the bad sense) being dropped on the heads of the residents in the area.

Oh the drama!

[dubone]

yikes. no question in my mind that council will approve it.

the TOD argument is weak, though, as it is the furthest point from two transit stops, and only a small portion of the lot is in the radius that is considered for TOD.

Maybe the observer hadn't notice, but south boulevard is a retail and industrial area, not residential. The decisions to place residential next to those existing industrial and commercial developments was done almost a hundred years ago, when those uses created many more negatives than shoppers buying mulch and plywood.

Oh well. The cat is out of the bag on this one, in my opinion. If dilworth residents don't like it, they should have bought the land and put something different there.

[A2]

The vote on allowing this store, I believe, is supposed to take place tonight.

Rather than be an shoe in as originally expected, The Dilworth Homeowners Association has changed its mind and come out against the plan. I think they voted it down last night, so one can assume the pressure will be on the councilpeople to vote against the rezoning.

And even the very booster positive Observer has put a rather dunning editorial cartoon in today's printed paper indicating that Lowes would be bad for the area and will hurt the plan to get people onto the LRT. They referred to it as "Big Box Retail". (in the bad sense) being dropped on the heads of the residents in the area.

Oh the drama!

The reason is because of two protest petitions. The council members now have to have 3/4 majority vote tonight for this thing to be built.

Here is my beef with Dilworth:

Why the Hell do you NOT want an impressive urban Lowe's? Would you rather have a body shop and a battery store there. It not only looks bad, but it does nothing for that end of town. If they throw up the argument of traffic, I will laugh my ass off. I think it is REALLY naive for residents to assume that the Lowe's will bring in enough traffic to disrupt life in their little neighborhood. They really need to consider moving (those who oppose the project) rather than fighting the growth of the city. If you want to live in an Urban enclave of Charlotte be prepared to deal with development, if not, then pack your bags and move to the country.

Geeez !

A2

[monsoon]

Well they do have a point about the traffic. It's follly to believe the vast vast vast majority of the people going to this store will not do so by the automobile. And then there are the employees who can't afford to live in the area and the restocking trucks bringing in everything that one sees in a modern lowes including trucks for stocking the coke machines. Its going to dramatially change the area around N. Dilworth and W. Dilworth.

I will say that if they lose this one, then it will probably sunder the Dilworth HOA in terms on how much control they will have in future development in the area.

[A2]

Well they do have a point about the traffic. It's follly to believe the vast vast vast majority of the people going to this store will not do so by the automobile. And then there are the employees who can't afford to live in the area and the restocking trucks bringing in everything that one sees in a modern lowes including trucks for stocking the coke machines. Its going to dramatially change the area around N. Dilworth and W. Dilworth.

I agree there will be an increase, but to tout that as the only argument is silly. S Blvd is a nightmare to begin with. I used to live off of Poindexter. The biggest addition to traffic is not going be a Lowe's, but rather the combined projects all along S Blvd that are u/c or soon will be. If they deny the Lowe's store from being built we are left with an UGLY body and battery shop.

Now if I were a Dilworth resident, I would be beging to have those ugly, no character, blighted structures torn down. Right now there is a ton of traffic and it is not going to ease up just because they decide NOT to build the Lowe's. It is going to happen regardless due to all of the residential and retail going in along that coridor. Why stop this development, which is a step forward in containing sprawl. I am highly PISSED off that residents are so damn stupid. Sorry to be so frustrated, but the alterniative is to stand by and let stupid people dictate how the city is built.

A2

[dubone]

i am still confident that 3/4 of the council will approve it. lowe's made so many concessions and it is south blvd for crying out loud. I have no question in my mind that it'll be approved. but we'll see... the dilworth nimnnnnnby's (not in my neighbor's neighbor's neighbor's neighbor's neighbor's back yard) may have more political power that we might expect.

[atlrvr]

I am highly PISSED off that residents are so damn stupid. Sorry to be so frustrated, but the alterniative is to stand by and let stupid people dictate how the city is built.

A2

You could send an e-mail to all of the city council members supporting the project like I just did.

While I don't doubt it will bring more traffic, it certainly will bring less than what many of the neighboring residents say they want....a mini-Birkdale village. My opinion is if the city opposes this, then they are approving sprawl, because if a store that has been tinkered with this much to fit into an urban environment, and costing the company already in the millions, can't be approved, then there is little chance that any retailer will ever attempt to create a good urban design, and will be happy to wallow in sprawl.