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We discussed a while back about us supposedly being overly critical on Orlando's plethora of too good to be true projects and it was suggested I was being too hard on these budding entrepreneurs. Just in time for the new year, here's an update on one of the exemplars of the species:

https://www.scottjosephorlando.com/news/4191-indicted-mingos-investor-arrested-attempting-to-fly-to-ecuador

From Scott Joseph

Whether we're talking Rocket City, Glenn Turner's Koscot debacle (and his Seminole County castle!) or World Trade Center Orlando, just to name three, Central Florida has long been a scammer's paradise. The one that was cloaked in all sorts of upscale trappings was downtown's Tradition Towers, which many insisted was a perfectly acceptable project even though the only high-rise project the developer ever completed previously was a college dorm.

Look at the track record to find out just how likely something is to come to fruition. It will rarely steer you wrong.

Edited by spenser1058
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9 hours ago, spenser1058 said:

Look at the track record to find out just how likely something is to come to fruition. It will rarely steer you wrong.

Amen.

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23 hours ago, spenser1058 said:

We discussed a while back about us supposedly being overly critical on Orlando's plethora of too good to be true projects and it was suggested I was being too hard on these budding entrepreneurs.

For at least my critical comments, I felt that people on here seemed to want some of these projects to fail, not that I was debating the likelihood of them to succeed. For the most part, if financing isn't in place, projects are pretty unlikely to get done, and getting financing on anything big is  really tough. That doesn't mean the ideas are bad though , just perhaps somewhat unrealistic or doesn't have the actual talent/resources to get it done. They deserve a chance... they deserve skepticism, but a chance. Projects like iSquare would, IMO, be great for I-Drive... of course I do realize its unlikely to actually happen, but we shouldn't say it shouldn't happen.

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Locked behind paywall. Is this article regarding the possibility of a third Universal Studios park or something else entirely? Since it's the OBJ, I expect it to be pure speculation and hype.

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Look like its some analyst is speculating that Universal is due for a new park and its possible there will be an announcement soon.  All speculation really.

I read something similar last week that an analyst expects Amazon to buy Target this year, and the major news sites ran with it.   Its just speculation.  As long as they put a ? at the end of the headline they have plausible deniability.

Edited by codypet
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16 minutes ago, metal93 said:

Locked behind paywall. Is this article regarding the possibility of a third Universal Studios park or something else entirely? Since it's the OBJ, I expect it to be pure speculation and hype.

It will almost definitely be Universal (if not some outside party that doesn't yet have a property in Orlando).  Universal is sitting on the land for it now.  There are some legal issues with the land that are preventing anything going forward at the moment, but give Universal a few years and it will happen.  Designs and plans have already begun to be drawn up according to sources on Inside Universal, and those same people leaked past attractions before announcements.

TLDR: It is now a question of when not if for Universal's 3rd gate.

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53 minutes ago, metal93 said:

Locked behind paywall. Is this article regarding the possibility of a third Universal Studios park or something else entirely? Since it's the OBJ, I expect it to be pure speculation and hype.

Its nothing new that isn't an existing rumor. It could possibly be referring to the Artegon property (and parcel immediately south of it that is under contract for some theme park uses as well (rumors are a WWE theme park on this site, or one of the regional operators opening up some sort of thrill park there, previously the site of the proposed but rejected Orlando Thrill Park). Hell, it could be referring to Skyplex and its associated attractions as well. The other "larger" rumor which OBJ could possibly call a theme park is Ripleys building a showcase of all of their different attractions on the new piece of land they bought, possibly with some shared admission packages. With 4 of these items as possibilities that would fit the OBJ article description, they probably are bound to be right, 1 of them will be formally announce/start construction this year. Hell, with as much stuff that is brewing and the economy/tourism going the way it is, its very possible 2 of them get off the ground this year.

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On ‎1‎/‎12‎/‎2018 at 3:46 PM, aent said:

 (rumors are a WWE theme park on this site...)

As long as I get to bodyslam a live human and stand over them yelling "TAKE THAT BROTHER!!!" then I'm for this.

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44 minutes ago, spenser1058 said:

Extreme Action Park or car museum? Which would you prefer?

Miami developer buys Artegon Marketplace property
http://bit.ly/2mLDQnl

From the Sentinel

Definitely sounds like they lost whoever the initial buyer for this property was (the theme park tenant)... and possibly are going to try to court back some old tenants? What a cluster... OBJ's only possiblity for being right now sounds like Universal (or Skyplex, if that counts)

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Because OBJ has such a stellar track record. . .

Actually, Extreme Action Park sounds like a great idea. Indoor MTB/BMX/Jump park, Skate/Scooter Park, Velo-drome , Skating Rink/Ice Rink, Maybe add on for a Ski simulator, or Indoor Surfing Wave Pool, or other options not readily available and have it close to theme parks and WWOS as well as ample hotels, and you probably have a winner. 

Edited by dcluley98
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11 hours ago, dcluley98 said:

Because OBJ has such a stellar track record. . .

Actually, Extreme Action Park sounds like a great idea. Indoor MTB/BMX/Jump park, Skate/Scooter Park, Velo-drome , Skating Rink/Ice Rink, Maybe add on for a Ski simulator, or Indoor Surfing Wave Pool, or other options not readily available and have it close to theme parks and WWOS as well as ample hotels, and you probably have a winner. 

Exactly what I was thinking. I've seen proposals for wave pools around I-Drive before, but nothing has ever come to fruition. This location would be perfect for something like Fantasy Surf in Kissimmee.

Or something even better. This one is in NEW HAMPSHIRE for cryinoutloud!!!.... :shok:

We ought to have something AT LEAST as good as that!!! 

Come on, Orlando.

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There was a skate park and rope course in Artegon before. There was also plan to build the wave park and you can still see the empty lot and tank at the back of Artegon. The Vans skate park was closed and the wave park never materialized.  Why do they think it will work this time?

The entire area need to be torn down and urbanized.

 

 

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I agree with you 100% with tearing down the mall. It will probably be back on the market in another 5 years. I wish  they could be build something like The Meydan One Mall in Dubai or Hard Rock Casino in Hollywood FL.

Edited by tc01

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On 1/17/2018 at 2:03 PM, sunshine said:

There was a skate park and rope course in Artegon before. There was also plan to build the wave park and you can still see the empty lot and tank at the back of Artegon. The Vans skate park was closed and the wave park never materialized.  Why do they think it will work this time?

The entire area need to be torn down and urbanized.

 

 

I hate to say it but I think this is an example of throwing good money after bad.  That mall does not make money from the cinema and Bass Pro.  If they did, they would be in better shape.  It’s really too bad the mall closed as it was in it’s latest iteration.  I went there a lot hoping it would make it.  They need to develop the outparcels as chain restaurants and get rent money in.  Volusia Mall is doing that right now over in Daytona to expand it’s income sources; they’re gonna develop an expansion that will house 6 restaurants while demolishing Sears Auto Center.

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On 1/17/2018 at 10:42 AM, JFW657 said:

Exactly what I was thinking. I've seen proposals for wave pools around I-Drive before, but nothing has ever come to fruition. This location would be perfect for something like Fantasy Surf in Kissimmee.

Or something even better. This one is in NEW HAMPSHIRE for cryinoutloud!!!.... :shok:

We ought to have something AT LEAST as good as that!!! 

Come on, Orlando.

I’m pretty sure the wave park was open at artegon back in the day. 

However, you guys all make a great point that I stress every time I hear the tourism industry in Orlando is overbuilt. There’s no reason we shouldn’t have everything Dubai is creating right now - we will most likely be the most visited city in the planet at some point.  

Imo, the city should double and triple down on tourism and encourage all ancillary industries to tourism to base operations here. I like the tech innovation push but I think most of our efforts should be spent where we have clear advantages (tourism, space, healthcare).  We should also consider focusing on industries that will benefit from our robust population growth (healthcare and education have already hugely benefited from population growth alone)

Tourism can also mean more than just theme parks, one example might be medical tourism, which would take advantage of our central location, good airport connections, strong local health systems, and robust lodging infrastructure. 

Just a couple random thoughts.....

 

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1 hour ago, sunshine said:

The city has taken advantages of the tourism for a lot of stuff but building an urban paradise is not part of it.

My thoughts exactly. Which is a shame, because so many pieces of our tourism industry are essentially walkable, new-urban community centers. There's some great "placemaking" going on at Disney Springs and Lowes Portofino. Pointe Orlando and the Orlando Eye complex are improving I-Drive. There's the obvious walkability of the theme parks, specifically Magic Kingdom's Main Street, EPCOT's country pavilions, and both Harry Potter areas at Universal.

Somehow, we're capable of attracting cool—if touristy—places in Orlando, but we're terrible at connecting them with transit and avoiding the sprawling strip-mall-hell that pops up between destinations.

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It was once observed in constructing Disneyland that Walt was building the antidote for all of the sprawl being erected  in the '50's and we could see what we had lost.

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On 1/21/2018 at 11:22 AM, leondecollao said:

I’m pretty sure the wave park was open at artegon back in the day. 

However, you guys all make a great point that I stress every time I hear the tourism industry in Orlando is overbuilt. There’s no reason we shouldn’t have everything Dubai is creating right now - we will most likely be the most visited city in the planet at some point.  

Imo, the city should double and triple down on tourism and encourage all ancillary industries to tourism to base operations here. I like the tech innovation push but I think most of our efforts should be spent where we have clear advantages (tourism, space, healthcare).  We should also consider focusing on industries that will benefit from our robust population growth (healthcare and education have already hugely benefited from population growth alone)

Tourism can also mean more than just theme parks, one example might be medical tourism, which would take advantage of our central location, good airport connections, strong local health systems, and robust lodging infrastructure. 

Just a couple random thoughts.....

 

They never built the wave park.  It was  to be a building attached to it’s east side that was never built.  You could see it’s footprint as a rectangle of dirt from Google satellite view.  FYI,  I’ve been going there since the beginning.

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3 hours ago, alex said:

My thoughts exactly. Which is a shame, because so many pieces of our tourism industry are essentially walkable, new-urban community centers. There's some great "placemaking" going on at Disney Springs and Lowes Portofino. Pointe Orlando and the Orlando Eye complex are improving I-Drive. There's the obvious walkability of the theme parks, specifically Magic Kingdom's Main Street, EPCOT's country pavilions, and both Harry Potter areas at Universal.

Somehow, we're capable of attracting cool—if touristy—places in Orlando, but we're terrible at connecting them with transit and avoiding the sprawling strip-mall-hell that pops up between destinations.

Transit costs money.  Money comes when there is a huge population.  We don’t have that population or density.  Miami does.  The only reason we have CRT is because the tracks and easement were already there, otherwise, no way.

On a side note, GOAA shut down Maglev because they would have lost $$$ from the car rental business lost.  Maglev had an I-Drive Circulator proposal and financial backing apparently.  But who knows.  Also, LRT was nixed back in the Late ‘90’s (Altamonte to Universal down the I-4 easement?) and could’ve been the first leg of a good system...maybe.

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7 minutes ago, jrs2 said:

Transit costs money.  Money comes when there is a huge population.  

In our case we have a big local population and an enormous tourist population—and the tourist development tax. It may have been discussed before, but the first paragraph in a 2016 article always comes to mind:

Quote

Since Orange County began assessing a room tax nearly 40 years ago, it has pulled in more than $3 billion and nearly 90 percent has been spent on just two things: a giant convention center and national ad campaigns aimed at luring more overnight guests.

Even a year's worth of TDT money ($226 million in 2015 alone) would be a huge start to getting something off the ground that benefits tourists and locals.

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