Strengths & Weaknesses of SC Cities

[motonenterprises]

So the diversity in Gville is irrelevant just becuase it happens to be near NC and GA?

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I agree with that question.

[waccamatt]

So the diversity in Gville is irrelevant just becuase it happens to be near NC and GA?

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No, a greater portion of Greenville's population is from out of state because the county is next to 2 neighboring states. Richland and Charleston Counties are much further from bordering states. A true analysis would be to see what percentage of people are moving in from which states.

[gs3]

That percentage of people moving in from out of state can also be deceptive. Columbia is 70 miles from the state line and Greenville County borders NC and is very close to Georgia. This probably accounts for most of that difference.

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With Greenville being so close to these state lines, seems the people would commute, not move. 30 minutes.....easy commute. 11% difference between out of state residents in Greenville and Columbia seems more to do with Greenville's business growth that has attracted more out of state investment. Thats why I'm here (from DC) and why four people that work for me are here from Nashville, Dallas, Pittsburgh and Princeton. All out of staters here (and not just from over the line). And all of us are diverse!

[waccamatt]

With Greenville being so close to these state lines, seems the people would commute, not move.  30 minutes.....easy commute.  11% difference between out of state residents in Greenville and Columbia seems more to do with Greenville's business growth that has attracted more out of state investment.  Thats why I'm here (from DC) and why four people that work for me are here from Nashville, Dallas, Pittsburgh and Princeton.  All out of staters here (and not just from over the line).  And all of us are diverse! 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I guess we'd have to see census numbers for what areas people have moved to each county from. I was born out of state, as were a fair number of my co-workers. It's hard to say without seeing the data.

[Topher1]

This list was posted on a few other forums, most recently by TheBrad at SSC... It shows the percentages of residents in each metro that resides in the same state of their birth. It apparently is Census 2000 data, judging by the MSA names and definitions. A higher ranking means that the city has the LOWEST percentage of out-of-staters living there. I've extracted just the SC metros, and those MSAs that include some SC counties.

54. Florence, SC 76.96%

139. Sumter, SC 66.26%

140. Greenville--Spartanburg--Anderson, SC 66.00%

177. Columbia, SC 61.83%

217. Charleston--North Charleston, SC 56.67%

220. Charlotte--Gastonia--Rock Hill, NC--SC 56.24%

234. Augusta--Aiken, GA--SC 53.91%

271. Myrtle Beach, SC 45.36%

Here's a link to the full list posted on SSC.

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=195393&page=2

[The_sandlapper]

So is it saying Myrtle Beach has the highest % of out of staters? I can see that Myrtle has ton's of baby-boomers from up north moving there. Most of my co-workers were from CT, IL, NY, NJ, PA and such.

[Topher1]

It appears so... I can also vouch for the Augusta area being ranked 2nd, behind MB, since some of the biggest industries are military, medical, government(SRS), and retirement. I was one of very few people in my high school classes that was born in-state (the locals tended not to be the brightest in the school )

[GvilleSC]

Little rough on us in Greenville aren't you? Our weakness contains more words than our strength. Lots of things missing. I am sure other Greenvillians agree.

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I agree. I'd take Greenville and it's religious influence any day of the week over the others!

[krazeeboi]

I'm just in the mood for bumping old threads tonight; ask no questions.

More weaknesses that I don't think I saw mentioned:

--State often doesn't look too hot in comparison to our neighbors in several regards

--State often ruled by rural interests (it bore repeating)

--Lack of young leaders in influential positions statewide

--State government infrastructure

More positives:

--Our 3 major cities are pretty much on par with each other

--Pretty good intra-state cooperation

--Pretty good beaches

--Interstate system, in terms of number AND placement (no concrete rivers thru downtown)

--Classic Southern hospitality

[GreekFreak]

A Columbia Native here......when referring to shopping....Charleston is the best in the state....although i go to Charlotte mostly but thats NC....anyways..... I just find it weird that Columbia is so much bigger in population than Charleston but for some reason Charleston grabs all the tenants(mainly on King St.)....must be cuz of tourism no doubt......I know this is not that improtant but why is Columbia the only metro in SC to not have an Aeropostale store? I find that very odd....and we were 3rd in getting an Abercrombie & Fitch....Greenville & Charleston had theirs way before we did......Why is the biggest mall in SC in Greenville and not in Columbia? Columbia needs to catch up on the shopping scene....and the Village at Sandhill doesnt seem to be bringing any significant stores to the area......mostly stuff we already have(mostly Harbison stores)....

[GvilleSC]

A Columbia Native here......when referring to shopping....Charleston is the best in the state....although i go to Charlotte mostly but thats NC....anyways.....  I just find it weird that Columbia is so much bigger in population than Charleston but for some reason Charleston grabs all the tenants(mainly on King St.)....must be cuz of tourism no doubt......I know this is not that improtant but why is Columbia the only metro in SC to not have an Aeropostale store? I find that very odd....and we were 3rd in getting an Abercrombie & Fitch....Greenville & Charleston had theirs way before we did......Why is the biggest mall in SC in Greenville and not in Columbia?  Columbia needs to catch up on the shopping scene....and the Village at Sandhill doesnt seem to be bringing any significant stores to the area......mostly stuff we already have(mostly Harbison stores)....

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I don't believe that Haywood Mall is SC's largest anymore... but Greenville County is by far the largest county in the state. So, why not Greenville?

[vicupstate]

I don't believe that Haywood Mall is SC's largest anymore... but Greenville County is by far the largest county in the state. So, why not Greenville?

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I believe the new mall in Myrtle Beach is the largest now. I think it is called Coastal Grande. Also, keep in mind that Columbia has MORE malls than Greenville, even if Haywood is the largest between the two cities. For the moment at least, Haywood is the only enclosed mall in Gville. McAlister Square is no longer primarily retail oriented and Greenville Mall is largely vacant. Meanwhile Columbia has Columbia Mall, Columbiana and Dutch Square. Richland Mall is in a similiar situation to Greenville Mall and McAlister.

[krazeeboi]

Wow, Columbia doesn't have an Aeropostale? Interesting...

[GvilleSC]

I believe the new mall in Myrtle Beach is the largest now.  I think it is called Coastal Grande.  Also, keep in mind that Columbia has MORE malls than Greenville, even if Haywood is the largest between the two cities.  For the moment at least, Haywood is the only enclosed mall in Gville.  McAlister Square is no longer primarily retail oriented and Greenville Mall is largely vacant.  Meanwhile Columbia has Columbia Mall, Columbiana and Dutch Square.  Richland Mall is in a similiar situation to Greenville Mall and McAlister.

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I'm not saying that we shouldn't have more enclosed malls, but I have talked to several people in Columbia and they hate their mall situation. All the stores are spread out between those malls and therefore they must travel to several places to go to a select few stores. One even ventured to say, that'd he'd almost rather drive to Greenville, get all his shopping done in one place, rather than drive around Columbia to hit up different stores.

[The_sandlapper]

Well in defense of poor ol Columbia. There is a Banana Republic store in Columbiana Centre for "higher" end shopping

[Spartan]

Westgate and Haywood were tied as the largest malls in the state at 1.1million sq ft. Grand Coastal in MB is now the largest at 1.2million. Haywood and Westgate are still pretty big. The difference is that Westgate has more anchor spots and room for large tennants while Haywood has more room for smaller retailers.

I've often wondered why Greenville doesn't have another mall someplace else.

In Columbia there is at least two of everything, so it is only necessary to live on one side of town and not travel to the other. Its more efficient. Unless you have a specific store in mind, the fact that these 'select stores' you mention are so spread out is irrelevant. When I lived there I was sometimes irritated that they didn't have a certain store at Harbison, but it was never necessary to go to one of the other malls to find it.

[GvilleSC]

Westgate and Haywood were tied as the largest malls in the state at 1.1million sq ft. Grand Coastal in MB is now the largest at 1.2million. Haywood and Westgate are still pretty big. The difference is that Westgate has more anchor spots and room for large tennants while Haywood has more room for smaller retailers.

I've often wondered why Greenville doesn't have another mall someplace else.

In Columbia there is at least two of everything, so it is only necessary to live on one side of town and not travel to the other. Its more efficient. Unless you have a specific store in mind, the fact that these 'select stores' you mention are so spread out is irrelevant. When I lived there I was sometimes irritated that they didn't have a certain store at Harbison, but it was never necessary to go to one of the other malls to find it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't shop in Columbia. So, I don't know what's going on retail wise down there, but this was told to me by a local who has grown up in that city and lives there now...

[The_sandlapper]

Well since we are on the subject of malls Columbia Place is 1 mill. sq. ft. Not as large as 1.1 or 1.2 but can you really tell the difference?

[Spartan]

With Columbia Place? No. I couldn't tell the difference. I rather liked it, and I don't understand why people do not like it except that the outside "looks" alittle crappy. A 100,000 sqft difference is impercievable after 1 million sqft.

Columbiana is noticably smaller (maybe 700k?), and I don't really like it all that much.

Maybe I'm just biased towards my hometown but Westgate is just a good mall. Its layed out well, and its easy to navigate. Haywood is a cool mall, but its impossible to navigate becuase the stairs are very inconvenient. Maybe they are changing that though. I haven't been since the rennovations started.

[sonofaque86]

Atleast NE Columbia is getting more shopping....I know they didn't like going 20 or so miles out the way to Harbison to shop if they didn't want to go to Columbia Place

[goodbye]

With Columbia Place? No. I couldn't tell the difference. I rather liked it, and I don't understand why people do not like it except that the outside "looks" alittle crappy. A 100,000 sqft difference is impercievable after 1 million sqft.

Columbiana is noticably smaller (maybe 700k?), and I don't really like it all that much.

Maybe I'm just biased towards my hometown but Westgate is just a good mall. Its layed out well, and its easy to navigate. Haywood is a cool mall, but its impossible to navigate becuase the stairs are very inconvenient. Maybe they are changing that though. I haven't been since the rennovations started.

A late reply, but I have to disagree with you on Haywood being difficult to navigate as opposed to Westgate. Westgate, IMO, is far more difficult because it is laid out on one level, meaning you must walk further to reach stores on the other end. I get confused at times trying to find a particular store. That being said, I think both Haywood and Westgate are very nice malls for the Upstate. Haywood serves a larger regional crowd than Westgate, but Westgate has given people another reason to visit Spartanburg as well.

[Spartan]

Well, by the time I find a staircase to ascend at Haywood I would have walked the same distance as at Westgate But like you said, they are both good malls.

[waccamatt]

I've been in Aeropostale (yawn) and I hardly mind that there isn't one in Columbia. They don't offer anything unique. I live in-town and rarely need to go to the malls other than an occassional trip once every couple of months. There are plenty of awesome specialty shops in both Five Points and the Vista. I prefer to spend my money at locally owned stores as opposed to chain stores, anyway.

[Ness]

I know there might be some repetition here, but:

Greenville strengths: lively downtown, aggressiveness in attracting quality employment, dominant position in regional hierarchy.

Weaknesses: extreme poverty in urban neighborhoods (like many cities), connectivity of transportation network (especially outside of city limits but in metro area), conservative land use regulations.

[goodbye]

I can agree with that. I'm very glad to see the plans for revitalization of so many poor neighborhoods. It would be great if the Government would mandate requirements for any financial aid to these people. I think free money keeps many of them in such a condition.