Retail/stores you would like to see in SE VA

[baobabs727]

I bet the hampton roads area would enjoy a Ukrop's or two. Williamsburg has fallen in love with it too and they are building a second location there to fulfill the demand which is scheduled to open 2006.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think Ukrop's would be a great addition to the community, especially since Harris Teeter has been a disappointment and The Fresh Market (Hilltop) is so small. Unfortunately, I have heard that the Ukrop family views our market as over-retailed and too plebian, with Food Lion and Farm Fresh's overwhelming market share and prime real-estate holdings, and the big box boys (Super K, Super Walmart and the Navy Commissaries) playing a major role on the "lower" end of grocery retail.

[wrldcoupe4]

I think Ukrop's would be a great addition to the community, especially since Harris Teeter has been a disappointment and The Fresh Market (Hilltop) is so small.  Unfortunately, I have heard that the Ukrop family views our market as over-retailed and too plebian, with Food Lion and Farm Fresh's overwhelming market share and prime real-estate holdings, and the big box boys (Super K, Super Walmart and the Navy Commissaries) playing a major role on the "lower" end of grocery retail.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Really....well that's interesting. At least here, they aren't even phased by the likes of Food Lion of Super Walmart. In fact, a few years ago, walmart built a supercenter within spitting distance of one of ukrop's oldest locations. So what did they do? they tore it down and have rebuilt a brand new (much more asthetically pleasing esp. compared to the walmart) shopping center anchored by ukrop's and Target. The new Ukrop's is about 55,000 sf and has all the amenities that mean Ukrop's. It opens in a couple months. Personally, from working with the company, I know they have been reluctant to place any stores outside of a 50 mile radius from their central kitchen and bakery (home base for all those incrediblly tasty foods ). Since they deliver all of there specialties to the every store every morning, they've had difficulty coming up with a solution. The new store in Roanoke is the big test I guess. If the supplying of their special items is successful there, I wouldn't rule out a store in hampton roads. They have an extremely conservative growth policy so that they dont lose their values and touch. Maybe by 2010 we'll be talking about a new location in hampton roads. However, if enough hampton roaders want it to happen, email the hell out of them. Maybe it could come sooner???

[baobabs727]

Wow, don't even get me started on that one. I think we could create a whole new thread just for that.

.......

Thats all i can thing of for now, i'm sure my fellow forumers can come up with many more. Stick around for a few days, you'll get an earful  .

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Ha! I can assure you that I am not a reporter! However, being a native of Va. Beach and a relatively new resident of Downtown, I do have a keen interest most all that is local development. (Yes, I believe that the CBD, Oceanfront AND Downtown can and will flourish!) I think your questions are great, and I'll also ask him when we will begin to see the retail explosion at Town Center. Sure, the restaurants are great, but I think everyone knows that Town Center will need to attract unique and upscale retailers (apparel, lifestyle, home, etc.) to realize its true potential as a shopping and entertainment destination.

[vdogg]

Ha! I can assure you that I am not a reporter!    However, being a native of Va. Beach and a relatively new resident of Downtown, I do have a keen interest most all that is local development.  (Yes, I believe that the CBD, Oceanfront AND Downtown can and will flourish!)  I think your questions are great, and I'll also ask him when we will begin to see the retail explosion at Town Center.  Sure, the restaurants are great, but I think everyone knows that Town Center will need to attract unique and upscale retailers (apparel, lifestyle, home, etc.) to realize its true potential as a shopping and entertainment destination.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes, retail, absolutely. It was never so disappointed as the day i learned that Gaylans had been canabalized and turned into another Dick's. I just looks so tacky now. I would love to see something like a Macys go there instead. And with the Westin being built right across the street, that Macys would flourish.

[baobabs727]

Really....well that's interesting. At least here, they aren't even phased by the likes of Food Lion of Super Walmart. In fact, a few years ago, walmart built a supercenter within spitting distance of one of ukrop's oldest locations. So what did they do? they tore it down and have rebuilt a brand new (much more asthetically pleasing esp. compared to the walmart) shopping center anchored by ukrop's and Target. The new Ukrop's is about 55,000 sf and has all the amenities that mean Ukrop's. It opens in a couple months. Personally, from working with the company, I know they have been reluctant to place any stores outside of a 50 mile radius from their central kitchen and bakery (home base for all those incrediblly tasty foods  ). Since they deliver all of there specialties to the every store every morning, they've had difficulty coming up with a solution. The new store in Roanoke is the big test I guess. If the supplying of their special items is successful there, I wouldn't rule out a store in hampton roads. They have an extremely conservative growth policy so that they dont lose their values and touch. Maybe by 2010 we'll be talking about a new location in hampton roads. However, if enough hampton roaders want it to happen, email the hell out of them. Maybe it could come sooner???

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Email campaign: Good idea! I sure hope you're right about Ukrops possibly overlooking the competition here. I've visited the Williamsburg Ukrops and Fresh Market. Both are great, but Fresh Market is more of a gourmet/natural foods/organic specialty grocer. Much smaller. Ukrops is a big, old-fashioned grocery store, a la Giant (NOVA, DC) and Wegman's (New York and now NOVA!). The Williamsburg market was absolutely starved for this type of thing for years. Glad to hear that #1 was such a success that an additional store is being built there.

[vdogg]

Email campaign: Good idea!  I sure hope you're right about Ukrops possibly overlooking the competition here. I've visited the Williamsburg Ukrops and Fresh Market.  Both are great, but Fresh Market is more of a gourmet/natural foods/organic specialty grocer. Much smaller.  Ukrops is a big, old-fashioned grocery store, a la Giant (NOVA, DC) and Wegman's (New York and now NOVA!). The Williamsburg market was absolutely starved for this type of thing for years.  Glad to hear that #1 was such a success that an additional store is being built there.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Never underestimate the power of being different. If Ukrops is truly as unique as everyone is saying then they will absolutely destroy the competition here. People in this area are getting tired of the sameness, thats why all these new urban style developments are taking off. People just want something different, and Ukrops could certainly carve itself a niche down here if they wanted to.

[urbanvb]

Vdogg, I've followed your posts on all of the other Hampton Roads/VB/Norfolk development boards, and I thank you for your timely and informed contributions.  Hey, I have a meeting with Gerald Divaris in a few days. The topic: the future of Town Center development.  Seeing as he has been the driving force behind Town Center for the better part of a quarter century, I'd like to be prepared to ask a few well-conceived questions of him.  I already have a few in mind, but do you have any ideas?  Thanks for the help!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This is GREAT! I am looking forward to hearing from you about your meeting.

[vdogg]

Geez, the Virginia forum has been absolutely on fire today. I think i'm one of the last mods standing, everyone else has gone to bed . Thanks everyone for keeping things so interesting today .

[baobabs727]

Yes, retail, absolutely. It was never so disappointed as the day i learned that Gaylans had been canabalized and turned into another Dick's. I just looks so tacky now. I would love to see something like a Macys go there instead. And with the Westin being built right across the street, that Macys would flourish.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You hit the nail on the head on both counts. True, the sucess of the Westin and of the lavish condos topping this 37 story (wow!) project are THE KEY to luring the upscale retail component to Town Center. Macy's would be a terrific addition! I could have sworn that the Galyan's/Dick's block was to be reserved for something besides a sporting goods store? I have a feeling that the developers had wanted Bloomingdales or Saks to go there. Afterall, both Richmond and Birmingham (smaller MSA's) landed a Saks in their Town Centers. Well, we still have the Taco Bell and Va. Pilot blocks. What superb visibility! Do you think the owners will sell willingly, or will the city have to condemn the properties?!

[vdogg]

You hit the nail on the head on both counts. True, the sucess of the Westin and of the lavish condos topping this 37 story (wow!) project are THE KEY to luring the upscale retail component to Town Center.  Macy's would be a terrific addition!  I could have sworn that the Galyan's/Dick's block was to be reserved for something besides a sporting goods store?  I have a feeling that the developers had wanted Bloomingdales or Saks to go there.  Afterall, both Richmond and Birmingham (smaller MSA's) landed a Saks in their Town Centers.  Well, we still have the Taco Bell and Va. Pilot blocks. What superb visibility!  Do you think the owners will sell willingly, or will the city have to condemn the properties?!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The city tried to buy the taco bell property years ago and the owners fought it all the way. The city abandoned its plans for that property temporarily because it would only be

in later phases that the property would be developed. We're coming up on a period of time when they'll seriously have to consider that issue again. The pilot is more than willing to sell and in fact i've heard rumors that they may become tennants in one of the towers eventually.

[wrldcoupe4]

You guys should definitely check out the Ukrop's in Williamsburg. Just don't plan your trip on a Sunday and don't plan on picking up a 12 pack of bud either Have lunch in the grill and cafe and stop by the Chef's Specialties case to pick up a gourmet dinner!

Judging by the way the new stores are, if HR was to get one it would almost definitely have the following:

-everything you expect in a grocery store (cept the alcohol)

-full floral dept.

-pharmacy and wellness center (some have a drive thru as well)

-first market bank (owned by ukrop's) location

-grill and cafe (2nd floor of the cafe would also have a celebration room which can accomodate up to 100 people)

-salad bar

-large natural and organics section

-photo development

-chef's specialties case

-International section (plus huge selection of specialty and international cheeses)

-sushi bar

-dry cleaning (one location also has an alteration shop)

-coffee/breakfast/icecream/smoothie bar

-the bakery and kitchen foods that make ukrops ukrops

**one of the new locations also has a full service YMCA location as well as a doctors office for up to 3 physicians, another location has a play area for kids so you don't have to put up with them while you shop...

**and of course someone always takes your groceries out to the car for you and the only tip allowed is a thank you.

I'd say its at least one up on Food Lion

They also have a new store concept called Joe's Market which would end up being a nice companion in the new VA beach town center.

[lammius]

Those Richmonders and their fascination with Ukrop's. It's like a civic pride thing for them.

[wrldcoupe4]

Those Richmonders and their fascination with Ukrop's.  It's like a civic pride thing for them.

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Lammius- trust me, when you grow up having one 5 minutes away and then end up going to school in D.C. with no Ukrop's in sight, its painful. I'm feelin the pain right now. A somewhat but not really comparison would be shopping at wegmans all your life and then having the only option be a food lion or a giant.

Funny thing is that they actually receive emails from people who are moving back to richmond after being away saying one reason they are coming back is that they miss having a Ukrop's.

[rusthebuss]

Agreed! So, what are some real ways of attracting these kind of companies? I believe we have an educated workforce, that I don't think that is the problem. I think the Peninsula is doing a better job (IMO) of attracting high paying jobs but that is because they have NASA over there as well as other high tech companies. One component of sucessfull cities is it's universities. ODU seems set on developing the campus in Norfolk so that is a plus. Hopefully, that will attract some attention. I do think the military makes it difficult because of the lower wages. That is one problem but alas we are dominated by the military and they are not going away. But if you think about it San Diego has a large base but they are doing quite well with the biotech industry.  I wonder what are the missing components here in Hampton Roads?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

They are no way as big military wise and they are not dependant of the military. The military did not build the area as well in San Diego.

[rusthebuss]

I think Ukrop's would be a great addition to the community, especially since Harris Teeter has been a disappointment and The Fresh Market (Hilltop) is so small.  Unfortunately, I have heard that the Ukrop family views our market as over-retailed and too plebian, with Food Lion and Farm Fresh's overwhelming market share and prime real-estate holdings, and the big box boys (Super K, Super Walmart and the Navy Commissaries) playing a major role on the "lower" end of grocery retail.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't I think we need them we have something better: Farm Fresh, I don't think we need someone else's chains here. We need ones that were started in the area.

[baobabs727]

I don't I think we need them we have something better: Farm Fresh, I don't think we need someone else's chains here. We need ones that were started in the area.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Not all Farm Fresh's are created equal. Some are nice, and some not so nice. Ukrop's is consistently great. Plus, competition will only make Farm Fresh and the rest of the sorry gang that much better--or else! Don't get me wrong, I'm all for supporting locally-owned stores, but I also want superior quality and value. The Hampton Roads consumer deserves nothing less.

[rusthebuss]

I don't like Ukrop's and Ukrop's doesn't go in some of the neighborhoods that Farm Fresh is in either. Some of the buildings that Farm Fresh is in were built in the 60's like Ward's Corner. Keep it local we have our own flavor

[wrldcoupe4]

I don't like Ukrop's and Ukrop's doesn't go in some of the neighborhoods that Farm Fresh is in either. Some of the buildings that Farm Fresh is in were built in the 60's like Ward's Corner. Keep it local we have our own flavor

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Rusthebuss- I respect the fact that you support a local company. I think that is very important especially with the rise of the dark side: super wal-mart. But just out of curiousity, what is it about Ukrop's that you don't like? There are several Ukrop's that are still currently in use that were built in the 60's and early 70's.

[rusthebuss]

I lived up there and just don't like the flavor of the area and the grocery store. Don't take it personal. I lived up there and didn't get along with to many people up there but i don't hate Richmond area. So i'm just expressing my opinion. I also think we don't need another metro areas grocery store here. I want this area to be orginal. Everyone from Richmond please do not be offended by this i'm just expressing my opinion. I know alot of richmonders talked bad about this area when i stayed up there.

[wrldcoupe4]

I lived up there and just don't like the flavor of the area and the grocery store. Don't take it personal. I lived up there and didn't get along with to many people up there but i don't hate Richmond area. So i'm just expressing my opinion. I also think we don't need another metro areas grocery store here. I want this area to be orginal. Everyone from Richmond please do not be offended by this i'm just expressing my opinion. I know alot of richmonders talked bad about this area when i stayed up there.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I don't take offense but I'm sorry you had a less than stellar experience up in the 804. And although many people here love shopping at ukrop's, not everyone here likes Ukrop's. Otherwise their market share wouldn't be 40%, it would be 100%. Originality is definitely a good thing and I think it has become even more important. Nowadays, you can go from suburban area X to suburban area Y and not even notice a difference. If my "Richmond" opinion counts for anything, I can't really think of anything bad about your area that we don't have bad here. Except for that damn tunnel traffic. Or all those Canadians vacationing at VA beach . Other than that, I'd say your area is if anything, underutilized, and has the potential to become much greater than it already is. IMO, we are your friends to the west, so I apologize for your poor experiences when you were up here.

[rusthebuss]

No problem, the real problem i have is the political problem with richmond which has nothing to do with the actual city. Richmond area is alot different from this area. The culture is alot different, i don't know if its the ocean flavor or what. I don't like the issues of roads being built there that is not needed. Richmond doesn't have bad traffic and yet they still build roads there that are not traveled very much like 185. But when this area needs something the money is all the sudden not available, but they sure like taking tax revenue from the area.

[Former Resident of HR]

Personally I am not a fan of Ukrop's because I do not like businesses that push moral values on people. Having said that though, I think that any new store that opens in our area would be a welcomed addition to Food Lion, Wal Mart and the Commissary. Food Lion is probably the worst grocery chain I have ever seen in this country besides Farmer Jack which thankfully went belly up.

As for civic pride, Farm Fresh is owned by Supervalu now, so it is part of the same chain that owns Shoppers in the DC area among others. What I do wish is that we had Safeway in this area. I heard that the GW Marketplace in Ghent was once one... does anyone know when they left the area? And that goes for Giant as well... Just curious.

[rusthebuss]

The Safeways we had hear years back where all ghetto and closed down.

[wrldcoupe4]

Personally I am not a fan of Ukrop's because I do not like businesses that push moral values on people.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Just out of curiousity, how do they do that?

[VAGATOR]

I heard that the GW Marketplace in Ghent was once one... does anyone know when they left the area?  And that goes for Giant as well... Just curious.

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It's still there. As for Food Lion, I see the Wal-Mart Supercenters putting them out of business in the near future.